Power builds.

Chnmmr · 12-13-06, 01:12 PM

I'm curious about something. This server is obviously against powerbuilds so why does it allow the obviously powerbuild Cleric 15 figher 5?

And another thing I'm curious about, why on earth do mages have the Tenser's transformation spell? Where is the sense on giving a mage who's disadvantage is supposed to be lack of melee pressence with a spell that turns them into a fighter with mage buffs ontop of that?

Two things I've always wondered and would really like to see people's views on this.

Hellblazer · 12-13-06, 01:14 PM

its not the powerbuild per say, i would think. But ther powerleveling that is the issue. There is a diference in between them. A cleric has to be able to stand in combat to heal, so it is naturall to asume they are already able to fight giving them the fighter atributes only contributes to their clerical abilities to go into melee and heal their comrades.

hawklen · 12-13-06, 01:17 PM

Here I am wasting time reading forum posts, when I can be power leveling

Eight-Bit · 12-13-06, 01:18 PM

I'm posting here to defend powerbuilds. My view is that if someone can RP their character, it doesn't matter how the mechanics work out. So long as it is approved, you can RP it. That's what I think. Nobody here would have any sort of class if it wasn't first approved by the GM team.

Tensers Transformation is a spell that comes at a cost of two things - prepared spells per day, and the ability to cast spells. It makes them out to be a fighter of an average build (not a so-called powerbuild), which when you consider the amount of damage a Mage can do over a wide area as opposed to a Tenser's Mage who is dealing damage to one target, you'll see it's not a big deal. It's a spell to be used as a last resort, really, if you want to be an effective mage. I know I personally groan when I see the level 11-12 mage going nuts with Tensers, when he/she could be dealing a whole lot more damage, and generally being a better asset to the party.

jrizz · 12-13-06, 01:25 PM

Cleric 15 fighter 5 is not a powerbuild really. It depends on how you get there. All multi-clasing has to be approved and has a RP reason behind it. Although you are right in that 5 fighter levels can really round out many classes. It all goes into how the PC is played, if the clreic at hand spends most of her in the front line then it makes sense that she would want to train in hand to hand combat more.

Got nothing to say about tenser's, just that once a mage hits a certain level they are solo monsters.

Ozy_Llewellyn · 12-13-06, 01:28 PM

Well considering I have power gamer credentials of my own, I can say that the build you mentioned has been approved before and is far from power gaming. It is a relatively weak build. When compared to say; 20 cleric. You may scoff at this of course, however I will happily trade points with you in PM’s.

Tenser’s Transformation is a classic D&D spell, the resulting 'transformed’ mage is actually not all that spectacular. The spells they unleash on themselves before don’t compare to have devoted those spells to a fighter before hand. Not to mention the whole loss of spells requiring re-memorization afterwards. Or that while transformed they can’t cast a thing. So while a powerful spell, being level seven it isn’t a kingmaker.

Chnmmr · 12-13-06, 01:31 PM

I'd really have no trouble seeing fighter clerics if the person roleplayed a cleric. I never see clerics use their dieties name in conversation, in battle calls or anything. Generally I can never tell if someone is a cleric untill they cast their spells, and even then can never tell what faith they are. Most clerics seem to come from a general mold.

Vyris · 12-13-06, 01:32 PM

Quote:

Chnmmr - 12/13/2006 4:12 PM

I'm curious about something. This server is obviously against powerbuilds so why does it allow the obviously powerbuild Cleric 15 figher 5?

And another thing I'm curious about, why on earth do mages have the Tenser's transformation spell? Where is the sense on giving a mage who's disadvantage is supposed to be lack of melee pressence with a spell that turns them into a fighter with mage buffs ontop of that?

Two things I've always wondered and would really like to see people's views on this.

Theres a lot worse power builds out there than cleric/fighter.

Ranger/rogue/weaponmaster springs to mind.

Vyris

Edit: I also wanted to say I agree with 8-bit on the RP justifying the classes, that should be paramount anyway, not that with class X you'll be capable of Y more points of damage per round. One sure way to remove any fun from the game or completely abandon RP is to start boiling characters down to numbers.

Vyris · 12-13-06, 01:35 PM

Quote:

Chnmmr - 12/13/2006 4:31 PM

I'd really have no trouble seeing fighter clerics if the person roleplayed a cleric. I never see clerics use their dieties name in conversation, in battle calls or anything. Generally I can never tell if someone is a cleric untill they cast their spells, and even then can never tell what faith they are. Most clerics seem to come from a general mold.

Look up Berdin sometime, I'll cram a little Vorax down your throat

Vyris

LordCove · 12-13-06, 01:36 PM

Theres a lot worse power builds out there than cleric/fighter.

Ranger/rogue/weaponmaster springs to mind.

Vyris

Thanks for that Vyris

*Sallaron rubs his hands together with glee*

Tanman · 12-13-06, 01:41 PM

Look out for Wanark Thangahaz'a and Muireann, Tarradon.

Those two clerics and paladins (that I know) RP their faith very well

Quote:

Chnmmr - 12/14/2006 12:31 PM

I'd really have no trouble seeing fighter clerics if the person roleplayed a cleric. I never see clerics use their dieties name in conversation, in battle calls or anything. Generally I can never tell if someone is a cleric untill they cast their spells, and even then can never tell what faith they are. Most clerics seem to come from a general mold.

hawklen · 12-13-06, 01:48 PM

I RP mine well, hence the picture with over 20 empty booze bottles around his passed out form. *nods sagely*

darkwulf365 · 12-13-06, 01:50 PM

Quote:

Look up Berdin sometime, I'll cram a little Vorax down your throat

I would recommend not going anwhere near Berdin. He's an obvious zealot, with some severe mental problems, possibly with origins reaching back into some sort of rough childhood. Other popular theories include him being under the effects of a Dominate Person spell, bad pipeweed, or too much ale at the local inn.

Stephen_Zuckerman · 12-13-06, 01:59 PM

You must not run into many decent clerics... Though there are a few that have good RP reasons for not mentioning their deities (Valkhyn springs to mind).

Spend some time with Ceviren Lightstaff. He's pretty devout.

Eight-Bit · 12-13-06, 02:00 PM

I don't know where you're coming from about the Cleric thing. I hear a lot of it. Sometimes too much. You need to expand your game a bit, and go out with some Clerics you didn't find AFK at the benches, I think.

hawklen · 12-13-06, 02:00 PM

*hijacks thread again*

Powerbuilds have feelings too!

*holds up a protest sign and sings protest songs*

Chongo · 12-13-06, 02:44 PM

You can make any class overpowered.

Anyone disputing this has gotten too used to pointing fingers.

Class power is an MC Escher staircase. There's always something better. It's all situational, and what you most often find is someone complaining at the a) prime of a character build, or b) particular niche of a character build. Builds meant for soloing lack in parties, builds meant for parties lack while soloing.

But moreso, you can make any class substantially underpowered. This is the other big spark for that person who's complaining.

Add value to the server. I'd contend that folks that bring up the subjects of powerbuilds, powerlevelling, powergaming, and every other powerxxxxing are as detrimental to the server as those characters out there bending or even severely warping the rules. It yields about the same amount of angst when you could instead be enjoying the world, and letting the quick fix folks fade on out.

Hellblazer · 12-13-06, 02:54 PM

Quote:

Chnmmr - 12/13/2006 6:31 PM I'd really have no trouble seeing fighter clerics if the person roleplayed a cleric. I never see clerics use their dieties name in conversation, in battle calls or anything. Generally I can never tell if someone is a cleric untill they cast their spells, and even then can never tell what faith they are. Most clerics seem to come from a general mold.

Come and talk to Lex'or, there is not one day since I have startd him that there has not been a rp about his faith or him talking of his diety.