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Author Topic: Ask the Loremaster: Cosmology  (Read 591 times)

EdTheKet

Ask the Loremaster: Cosmology
« on: August 05, 2007, 10:32:30 am »
Please post any questions on the new cosmology here. I will make this a running thread and update questions/answers.

1) considering how much shadow has been dealt with, including one of our World Leaders, an entire branch of the the Bloodstone plot quests, a complete shadow language, and the shadow dancer class in general, can you please fill us in on where Shadow fits in to the new Cosmology?

Shadows come from a lower/lowest energy world (so the low frequency worlds, see Mortal Coil description). Hence why their touch drains energy from creatures from a higher energy world. Their opposites are the Radiances from higher frequency worlds.

The shadow language is actually the language of the Lumbral, which those who went on that plot series received. So a more proper name would be the Lumbral language.

The shadowdancer does not travel to other lower frequencies when hiding in shadow, they're just very adept at using darkness and light. The summon shadow is something like summoning (so magic) and we're stuck with the D&D way of doing things there for NWN. The new planes structure was not made to accommodate all D&D specifics of course, as we're moving away. Some things will fit, others will not.

2) On the time section, does that mean that time passes more slowly for the negative energy realms than for the positive energy realms or is the frequency you're talking about there something different than the frequency of the realm itself?

The former.


3) How does Greater Sanctuary work now, as in D&D you walk the ethereal plane?

This is one of the things the new cosmology and D&D differ greatly as there is no ethereal plane. You can consider it as some kind of better invisibility, you not walking another frequency for example.
 
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vgn

Re: Cosmology FAQ
« Reply #1 on: August 05, 2007, 04:36:59 pm »
First, thanks Ed for that great preview.

Second, considering how much shadow has been dealt with, including one of our World Leaders, an entire branch of the the Bloodstone plot quests, a complete shadow language, and the shadow dancer class in general, can you please fill us in on where Shadow fits in to the new Cosmology?

Thank you.
 

Skywatcher

Re: Cosmology FAQ
« Reply #2 on: August 05, 2007, 06:40:41 pm »
On the time section, does that mean that time passes more slowly for the negative energy realms than for the positive energy realms or is the frequency you're talking about there something different than the frequency of the realm itself?
 

Lord of the Forest

Re: Cosmology FAQ
« Reply #3 on: August 06, 2007, 12:19:15 am »
I don't know in how far it is covered but how actually works Greater Sanctuary now? NWN one kinda lets you walk on the ethereal plane. How about it in the new cosmology?
 

EdTheKet

Re: Cosmology FAQ
« Reply #4 on: August 06, 2007, 05:20:44 pm »
Updated
 

Stephen_Zuckerman

Re: Cosmology FAQ
« Reply #5 on: November 24, 2007, 01:34:54 pm »
Where does the Plane of the Lost fit into the new Cosmology?
 

Dorganath

Re: Cosmology FAQ
« Reply #6 on: November 24, 2007, 03:12:22 pm »
That's kind of a tricky one to answer.  Ed might correct/confirm this, but at least in terms of seeking to bargain for a soul of someone who has died permanently, I think the best analog would be the place where the Binding and the Sheet meet, as this is the domain of the Harvester.
 

EdTheKet

Re: Cosmology FAQ
« Reply #7 on: November 25, 2007, 05:29:28 am »
Correct Dorg.
 

Pseudonym

Re: Cosmology FAQ
« Reply #8 on: December 22, 2007, 05:14:12 pm »
Question:- How much of this is common IC knowledge? Is the information in the link provided above all OOC or is such information deemed readily accessible? Known just to church folks or to Mr & Mrs Lvl 1 Adventurer as well? Accessible with a bit of digging? Accessible with a lot of digging?

Cheers
 

EdTheKet

Re: Cosmology FAQ
« Reply #9 on: December 23, 2007, 05:37:50 am »
How much of this is common IC knowledge?

Not much, especially to those of a non-wizard/non-scholar background. After all, people start as lvl 1, not as super wizards/scholars.

Is the information in the link provided above all OOC or is such information deemed readily accessible?

Most is OOC, to explain the planar structure we're using that's not DnD. That was the main reason for posting. It is most certainly not readily accessible.
Nobody PC or NPC knows about The Sovereign, nobody has ever traveled to the Heavens so would know about traveling there or how that works. (Apart from maybe an NPC or two which shall remain nameless ;)

Known just to church folks or to Mr & Mrs Lvl 1 Adventurer as well?

As mentioned most certainly not to Mr & Mrs Lvl 1 Adventurer. Some information about the Pits would be in some churches (but not for example, Prunilla's as that'd make no sense. Lucinda's would know things). And even there, not all all scholars of the Pits of course.
The frequency stuff and how that works is also something that hardly anyone knowns or understands.

Just like in the real world not every person knows about quantum physics for example. Or would know how to do brain surgery. It's very very specific knowledge and only a few would have it.
And as knowledge is power, few would share.

So basically if this wasn't told to your character, he wouldn't know.

Accessible with a bit of digging?
Some of it

Accessible with a lot of digging?
Some of it

PS my actual complete Cosmology document is larger, hehe ;)
 

lonnarin

Re: Cosmology FAQ
« Reply #10 on: August 24, 2009, 03:52:07 pm »
OK, huge pesky laundry-list of questions for you, Ed!

What will the goals/numbers of the denizens there be? Are they mostly powerful souls who resisted the Thread's attempts to reabsorb them, or more like an alien species that are native to the plane? Is it a fully realized extra-dimension with its own cosmos and worlds, or more like a bubble/pocket dimension parallel along the Threaded Path? What happens to a soul when the fiends steal it along the path? Eaten or twisted into members of the dark army?

Do the Pits of Endless Strife tie into the magical effects of necromancy's soul displacement? I could see perhaps a soul being taken from a wizard and being traded for an immortal dark energy equivalent to sustain their consciousness into lichdom. Since their "soul" was already taken away from the path, they wouldn't fear being reabsorbed after a natural death. Do undead animation effects tap into this sort of dark energy, or is that from a separate plane of existence altogether? (I know we don't have "shadow" anymore, is it the "Lumbral" now?)
 

Ravemore

Re: Cosmology FAQ
« Reply #11 on: August 24, 2009, 08:16:52 pm »
Ed, thanks for your earlier response. I was just curious why we are not using a language ear for the pits? I'm assuming they are populated by intelligent and nasty creatures who use verbal communication, and as a pure wizard working into higher levels, it is something that does interest me. Were we unable to change the name of the current "infernal" ear to another name, or was it a decision on the development side?

I love the work on this by the way... so cool.
 

Dorganath

Re: Cosmology FAQ
« Reply #12 on: August 24, 2009, 09:11:44 pm »
Quote from: Ravemore
Were we unable to change the name of the current "infernal" ear to another name, or was it a decision on the development side?

This was not a development decision but rather a lore one, due to our shifting from a D&D-style planar structure to one of our own making.  Remember also that there is an Abyssal language. "Infernal" and "Abyssal" languages have an implication of "devils" and "demons".  While people are free to call dwellers of the Pits anything they wish (for instance, "demon" might be a catch-all term for something wicked, evil and totally alien to the Mortal Coil), we do not actually have "devils" and "demons" as D&D has defined them.  Pit Dwellers are as varied as the Pits themselves, possibly moreso. The Pits are not necessarily "hellish", as has been stated,

More than a passing knowledge of the Pits (beyond their existence) is likely not a common thing (subject to Ed agreeing with me), even among the wizarding set.  Travel to the Pits is even more rare, difficult and potentially dangerous (and impossible without GM help).

So anyway, as the Pits aren't dominated by "devils" and "demons", there isn't any sort of "Infernal" and "Abyssal" languages of those dominant species of creatures that would be prevalent throughout.  Of course that begs the question as to what residents of the Pits speak, and as that answer has not yet been determined.
 

Ravemore

Re: Cosmology FAQ
« Reply #13 on: August 24, 2009, 10:12:12 pm »
Cool... makes perfect sense. I guess I'll wait for that determination on language and cross my fingers it is favorable for IC exploration at a later date...
 

Acacea

Re: Cosmology FAQ
« Reply #14 on: August 24, 2009, 10:33:59 pm »
Besides, when you think about it - anyone who did any plane-traveling before the new cosmology was put in was assumed to have been pit-traveling. So, you know... sure, you went to the Abyss, that's great...but what was once a huge deal (warranting the abyssal ear vs infernal for Baator), is now just one in a million millions of Pits. Even if you kept the literal infernal ear and pointed to grandfathering, with the absorption of those places into a much denser location makes it outnumbered and useless. No demons or devil distinctions to communicate with, just some ultra-specific stuff no one's ever going to run.

I'd kind of like to see them combined into a sort of Pit-Common instead... that way someone having it could still have some kind of use, its level of difficulty (or % known) can be set to whatever, and individual GMs can decide if their pit creature is at all skilled in it...since most would probably be rough and trade-speakish poor with it. Could be fun... not that useful, but better than 2 individual tongues in a place that has who knows how many. Maybe that "demon" knows just enough Pit-Common to tell you to pike off.

Alternatively, maybe we could take that whole merger and split it into 4 variations based on the elemental planes the pit is closest to. Dunno. Having crude combinations from different places are always fun, and now we get to start all over with slang.
 

lonnarin

Re: Cosmology FAQ
« Reply #15 on: August 25, 2009, 02:18:38 am »
Since the fiends steal souls being pulled along the threaded path, wouldn't that just make them twisted souls themselves?  Kind of like a Dante's Inferno fiend vs. an alien dimension WoW Burning Legion type?  In that case, wouldn't they just speak what they did in life?
 

Eorendil

Re: Cosmology FAQ
« Reply #16 on: August 25, 2009, 12:18:35 pm »
Well, except, (I'm assuming) for the fact that with all the frequencies you still have a nearly infinite possibility to the number of worlds, creatures, peoples and languages possible and the pits aren't just pulling souls from Layonara... basically... I think.. *winkles nose*
 

EdTheKet

Re: Cosmology FAQ
« Reply #17 on: August 25, 2009, 01:06:48 pm »
Quote

What will the goals/numbers of the denizens there be?

That depends on the denizen in question. As there are an endless number of Pits (in theory) there will be just as many goals.

Quote
Are they mostly powerful souls who resisted the Thread's attempts to reabsorb them, or more like an alien species that are native to the plane?

Denizens are not souls without a body. They're creatures, and you'll find humans, elves, dwarves, orcs, Balmati, and so on throughout the Pits.

Quote
Is it a fully realized extra-dimension with its own cosmos and worlds, or more like a bubble/pocket dimension parallel along the Threaded Path?

I believe I explained what a Pit is in the new Cosmology text. It's a finite "area/bubble/pocket" with particular characteristics. E.g. there will be desert-like Pits, Pits that look like seas, Pits that are a seemingly endless plain, or Pits that look like a small island. Anything is possible.
Threaded Path is a term you invented I think and not a term I'd use.

Quote
What happens to a soul when the fiends steal it along the path? Eaten or twisted into members of the dark army?
It can be eaten, harvested for power, kept as a pet.


Quote
Do the Pits of Endless Strife tie into the magical effects of necromancy's soul displacement?
Not sure what you mean by necromantic soul displacement, the Pits have Al'Noth just like the rest of the cosmos.

Quote
Do undead animation effects tap into this sort of dark energy, or is that from a separate plane of existence altogether?
Animation of the dead is done via the Al'Noth, not something different.

Quote
More than a passing knowledge of the Pits (beyond their existence) is likely not a common thing (subject to Ed agreeing with me), even among the wizarding set.
Agreed.

Quote
with all the frequencies you still have a nearly infinite possibility to the number of worlds, creatures, peoples and languages possible
Correct :) that was the intent.

Quote
and the pits aren't just pulling souls from Layonara... basically... I think..

Just for total correctness. The Pits do not pull souls, the Thread is what pulls. Creatures in the Pits can try to intercept/capture these souls.
These souls come from all worlds in the Mortal Coil, so not just Layonara.

And for completeness sake, with the various frequencies, it also means that there are Pits of other frequencies.
 

Eorendil

Re: Cosmology FAQ
« Reply #18 on: August 25, 2009, 02:12:20 pm »
Thanks for the correction.. I meant Thread.  :)
 

lonnarin

Re: Cosmology FAQ
« Reply #19 on: August 25, 2009, 04:41:12 pm »
Ahhh, it makes a bit more sense looking at the graphical chart.  I had this picture in my minds of some kind of rainbow road DragonBall Z thread that went through all the dimensions, but it looks more like the center of a wheel.  

Few more quick questions.  

What's a Balmati?

Do all gods dwell in the heavens, or do some of the more demented ones like Corath set up shop in the Pits of Endless Strife?
 

 

anything