Author Topic: Concerning... Druids (Read 120 times)

LordCove · « **on:** March 25, 2008, 12:51:45 pm »

A common druidic philosophy is that the gods themselves are a product of a confluence of natural forces. They evolved. It is considered blasphemous by many and in some places gives druids a hated outsider status, but to them the gods themselves emerged from nature and are in many ways subordinated to its fundamental flows and connections - LORE

Is it required for a Druid submission to choose a Deity? Or can they choose not to follow a specific God?
I surmise regardless of picking a Deity or not... a Holy Symbol must still be worn to cast certain Druidic spells. Is this correct?

The third means ( IE.. of becoming a Druid) is through a calling. - LORE

Besides their connection to nature, the one thing that unifies this diverse population is the complex, and highly secretive, druidic political order. - LORE

How would a Druid become a part of this order? Do they have to?
Could they not simply be "wayward" Druids? As in... have the connection to nature, cast the spells.... but have nothing to do with the Actual Druidic order and not be bound or held by their laws?

ycleption · « **Reply #1 on:** March 25, 2008, 01:01:51 pm »

Well, I can answer a few of those.

No, a druid does not need a deity.
Yes, a holy symbol, usually a symbol of the great oak, needs to be worn for those spells that require one.

As far as PC druids, they must agree to the three statements which imply that they are part of the hierarchy. Regarding other druids... that's intriguing. How would the druid order react to such a "wayward" druid?

Falonthas · « **Reply #2 on:** March 25, 2008, 01:34:36 pm »

a druid can choose a diety but they dont have too as above
some are part of the heirarchy and though not received well as such, as was the few who went rogue and formed their own band, though they still followed the heirophant they had other priorities

a druid is bound to serve nature, whether it be nature calm and happy or nature deadly and full of fury

sometimes one may have a disenting view on something set out by the whole, but in the end the ends justify the means

that wayward druid may only be wayward so to speak as long as a certain issue is at hand and being dealt with by the order

the order is hard to play out though because there are so few pc druids, and only one with an actual title in the order
rhizome is the heirophant
the other titled druids would be legodia, and freckled owl as those you could always find and pay respects too
Brisbane when she plays is high druidess of tilmar for thats where her grove lies, but still is treated as a high druidess no matter what isle she walks

no other druids have titles in the order, and once i asked about such for drogo when he was approaching 16th level, though power wise he was stronger then the titled druids,the npc ones mind you, he was still a wandering leaf who served the oak wherever he was needed
for him to gain a title would take a wlcdq was the answer i got after a while because it had never been thought about really

Falonthas · « **Reply #3 on:** March 25, 2008, 01:43:12 pm »

perhaps the heirarchy can be more defined, and actual titles earned as druids come into themselves

we have a generic guide in lore, but even in the churches you have ranks and such that dont need wl status to attain
just a cdq and then you have druid of the rolling plains( for example)
or even druid of the (insert forest or wood here)

you would have to earn such at milestone levels though, you would still be a leaf until at least lvl 10, but then if you wanted to seek that path, you could direct your development to a title at that time

then at 16 there could be another title level and then the high druid level at 20 with wl status if passed

those who dont wish to be seated on the council so to speak would just be wandering leaves, but they would still be called to council and their voice heard, but they would not have an actual vote

things to think about for the mmo

Acacea · « **Reply #4 on:** March 25, 2008, 04:15:56 pm »

Me, I'm just tired of seeing all this LN druid reaction stuff. Everyone is all hierarchy this and obey the Hierophant that. They are a wildly diverse organization...perhaps even a series of organizations would be a better phrase, since there are so many groups for different places and temperaments. The whole point is that despite all their differences and methods, they are all connected and serve each in their own way, a single purpose. Even that kind of irks me a bit, since your Deep druids swearing to the Great Oak is a bit of an eyeroller... it wouldn't be so bad if the symbol of the Heart of Nature were something that extended on multiple levels of existence, instead of having a single sacred oak in a forest. That just helps typecast all druids into forest druids, to me.

The idea of a tightknit global organization in which everyone has a title and rank just makes me shudder at the thought of playing a druid, you know? But maybe that's just the lack of an L in my alignment.

It's just that most of the recent druids - not all, before all druids come after me with a sharp stick yelling "FOR THE HIEROPHANT!" - seem to be part of this big bureaucracy of permissions and ranks. I have a druid sub that I've never submitted because she doesn't nod to authority or council at all - she is simply a part of a whole, which always seemed the point and yet not the way I have seen it in action. I can see factions of druids that take "the order" to heart and to its fullest extent, but that's just one more group in hundreds.

Falonthas · « **Reply #5 on:** March 25, 2008, 04:39:08 pm »

not really LN at all
take the wizards of high sorcery in dragonlance even though they had black red and white robes they all had a general goal for magic as a whole

and no not all druids should be titled and most wouldnt be
but im sure there are some who over time would

khuren still pays his respects to titled druids, but he only bows his head to rhizome as heirophant

some of the new leaves are more law inclined, they sure wont get along with khuren once his death druid past is brought to light

does he care no
if you gathered all the druids together right now, the only thing that could keep the peace would be rhizome showing up

because tempers would flare, and such
even with four druids sitting talking over basic things was a stretch and how they all reacted to the constant flow around them

and besides your more druid then you know acacea

ycleption · « **Reply #6 on:** March 25, 2008, 04:45:46 pm »

Acacea, I'm not sure if you're talking about how things are in game, or how they should be, or what... so I'm not sure if I'm agreeing or disagreeing you here, but...

From LORE: "Besides their connection to nature, the one thing that unifies this diverse population is the complex, and highly secretive, druidic political order. Each druid has a place within this order..."

Now, to me this doesn't mean that all druids have to be fervent followers of the system, and I think it's been pretty well established that the hierarchy doesn't impose much of anything on individuals unless they are actively unbalancing nature... so I really don't think it's a lawful or oppressive thing at all... or even "tightknight". (my druid, certainly, will tell you that she doesn't enjoy the company of most other druids). I think that even if you believe that the D&D alignments should be reflected in the way druids are, it's an appropriate N... each druid has a place, yes, but almost boundless freedom in how they go about it.

LORE also says that "Many" druids choose to use a symbol of the oak as a representation of Layonara and Nature. Not all, not even most. So yes, druids who participate in other ecosystems may find the Great Oak to be an empty symbol.
The way LORE is written about the analogy of the Great Oak to the hierarchy makes it clear that it's one way to understand it, certainly not the only way.

The point, to me at least, is that druids are connected. A wayward druid who doesn't acknowledge the hierarchy still can't avoid hearing the wind carry news of hunters slaughtering wolves, can't ignore a squirrel telling of an undead uprising in a nearby grove... it's this communication and connectedness that reinforces the druid order, not a commitment to hierarchy on the part of the individual druids.

Acacea · « **Reply #7 on:** March 25, 2008, 05:50:37 pm »

I meant in-game. I didn't say the writeup implied a tightknit global organization, but that various posts/reactions have nodded that way in the past. I was basically expressing my opinion of "god forbid they should become a tighter knit global organization, that would just be whacked." The parts you quoted were my point - a connection, not a "let me go before the great council of the druids to gain the necessary paperwork to..." which is a sentiment I have seen preached a couple times. It creeps me out.

So I would say we were agreeing, not disagreeing.

Regarding the Great Oak symbol, I was not really talking about the symbol around the neck. I would assume that ecosystems would look to symbols within their own regions. However, the Great Oak itself is huge. Not as in size, though that too, but in nature. All the Katians and druids and nature people refer to it as the Heart, it's the place of nature. Yeah, there are lots of big nature places around, in various ecosystems both secret and known. But the Great Oak has always been the place of Nature. So I was just saying, wouldn't it be cooler if somehow the symbol that stood for all of nature collectively spanned multiple versions instead of just being the one in the forest? Maybe you can visit the roots in the Deep or something.

I was really just looking for something that would give all ecosystems a similar purpose for a single system... we have one BIG symbol for nature, so it should be able to be shared by all druids, somehow. Not just the ones in the forest...perhaps even just receptacles for whatever crazy nature voodoo it has. To have symbols as big as the Oak in all ecosystems would devalue the one we have now. I'd rather make it bigger and more all-encompassing somehow.

I'm rambling now, and kinda thinking 'aloud' in text, but yeah I was talking about the Great Oak itself as the face of nature, not what symbol they choose to wear.

lonnarin · « **Reply #8 on:** March 25, 2008, 07:27:06 pm »

Quote from: ycleption

As far as PC druids, they must agree to the three statements which imply that they are part of the hierarchy. Regarding other druids... that's intriguing. How would the druid order react to such a "wayward" druid?

Well, Grovel was approved as a goblin druid with the strict understanding that no matter how many times I revised the bio, he would never be accepted by druidic society or any elves upon creation. Even raised by elves as an infant... nope nope, couldn't learn elven or be part of the druid society. So yes, there are rogue druids, else Ed and the rest of the approvers changed their minds since then.

In any case, he seems to get along with most druids since then, so has somewhat "entered" druidic society. It's just he never gets invited to any druidic events, can't vote, doesn't get any missions, etc. So in effect, there is some form of outcast druidic society.

Hierarchy? Sounds more like a human pyramid scheme. Nature has no hierarchy beyond eat or be eaten. Last I checked, folks above me in the hierarchy cooked their food and lived in cities, so you can pretty much guess how my feral little one thinks about that hierarchy.

So yeah, I'd side with Acacea on this one and say while there IS a hierarchy, it doesn't encompass all druids. Otherwise Rhizome of Legodia could just walk up the the druid guarding the mahoganey and tell them to stand down, and those people killed trying to get mahoganey could blame them for it. I'd just as soon assume that there were a multitude of different splinter groups, dens, wolfpacks, flocks and loose alliances as well as that big official one. There are just too many extremes in the druidic alignment, race and culture to assume that they all work on the same page all of the time. And if I'm utterly wrong about this, then please make the mahoganey druids passive tot he rest of us! heh.