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Author Topic: Cleric Meta-Magic  (Read 938 times)

drakogear

Cleric Meta-Magic
« on: January 16, 2013, 03:10:54 pm »
Something I recently been thinking about after finally realizing how great meta-magic can be. Though also kinda got me wandering... what sorta role play backing could there be to a cleric using meta-magic? They pray extra hard? Giving longer more drawn out prayers? There deity some how favors them more then other? :\
 
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cbnicholson

Re: Cleric Meta-Magic
« Reply #1 on: January 16, 2013, 03:28:37 pm »
Are you referring to the feats extended spell, empowered spell? I've always thought of them as an extension of the Spellcraft skill in that they allow the caster manipulate the way the spell/prayer is used.
"Give a man a mask and he will show you his true face." 

Oscar Wilde
 

drakogear

Re: Cleric Meta-Magic
« Reply #2 on: January 16, 2013, 04:21:28 pm »
Yeah, but all cleric spells come from there deity through prayers so how does a clerics (or any other divine casters) spells become extended/empower/maximized... or even praying/channeling there deities powers quick/silent/stilled?

Note: Still spell allows casting wile held, paralyzed, stunned, etc.
 

Lance Stargazer

Re: Cleric Meta-Magic
« Reply #3 on: January 16, 2013, 04:55:20 pm »
Personally I do think that each priest its diferent on their approach with their deities and the mechanical limiations are just that, for this i meant that Somehow the way a priest prays and how he manifest his faith has to show some changes on how the miracles are seen or provided.  With this I meant that not all of priest have the same skillsets and the miracles have to reflect their unique conection with each deity, the feats you pick are part of this conection, and how the priest faith is shown and how his/her prayers are replied to the deity.

Please take this as a personal opinion.
 

miltonyorkcastle

Re: Cleric Meta-Magic
« Reply #4 on: January 17, 2013, 10:17:28 am »
What Lance said. I think the metamagic feats and spells can be interpreted as the mechanical representations of the character's connection to their deity, and as Lance suggests, such connections have no reason to be exactly the same for everyone.
 

cbnicholson

Re: Cleric Meta-Magic
« Reply #5 on: January 17, 2013, 11:08:55 am »
Ah, the rp slant.  Katia's big hammer, Dragon's fury, etc.  Gotcha. ;)
"Give a man a mask and he will show you his true face." 

Oscar Wilde
 

Dorganath

Re: Cleric Meta-Magic
« Reply #6 on: January 17, 2013, 12:51:26 pm »
As my personal opinion, I like to look at casters as channelers of magic to one degree or other, and this channeling takes a particular physical toll on a person (which also neatly describes why they can only cast so many times/day at any given level of achievement).  Wizards were always explained (at least back in the early days) as only being able to memorize so many spells before their minds couldn't hold any more.  Level progression reflected a greater ability to memorize and thereby cast.  But what about Sorcerers and Bards? They don't memorize; they manipulate magic innately. What about Druids? Again, no memorization but more of a communing with Nature.

And what about Clerics? Surely their deities are not saying they can only pray a certain number of times per day and no more. Clearly, they could pray all they wanted, but only some prayers will bring magical effects, and such prayers will take a toll, of some sort, on the Cleric, just as it would on an arcane caster.

"But Dorg," you may ask. "Why would that be when it's the deity who answers those prayers and produces the magical effects?" Well, I'm glad you asked!  Again, the way I personally see it, the deity is providing the form and energy at the Cleric's request, but that energy is being directed through the Cleric like a focal point.  Though it's mechanically easier for Clerics to cast spells (i.e. no chance of failure from taking damage), the Cleric must still act as a focus for the spell's energies. Need proof? Many Cleric spells require material components and not just a holy symbol. Does the deity care that you don't have a diamond on your person to raise someone from the dead? No, likely not, but deities are still bound by the nature of magic and how the Al'Noth works.

For what it's worth, I've seen this RPed to a degree by Clerics, that being an excessive amount of casting resulting in fatigue...not mechanical fatigue (except for decreasing spell counts) but RPed fatigue.

Anyway, keeping along the casters-as-channelers concept, metamagic, particularly those like Extend, Maximize and Empower, speak to how good a person has gotten at channeling.  Maybe they can provide an extra punch to the spell's power or keep the channel open just a bit longer or whatever.  This analogy kind of works for other metamagic feats, including the Eschew feats. Spell components (of any sort) are basically aids in casting spells, but someone who gets good enough may be able to manipulate and/or channel magic in a way that doesn't require one or the other.

So in this sense, I'm breaking with the GMs who commented before me to say that, in my mind, metamagic for a Cleric doesn't have anything to do with one's relationship with their deity but is rather a personal/physical/metaphysical/supernatural trait of the caster that allows them to make better use of what the deity provides in answer to their very specialized prayers.

Ymmv.
 

lonnarin

Re: Cleric Meta-Magic
« Reply #7 on: January 18, 2013, 12:11:06 am »
On RP backing of metamagic feats, a cleric might use pieces of the god's dogma when casting such boons.  Lucindites for example might take the approach as a manipulation of spellcraft ability and skill much as a mage would.  Elemental gods like Mist, Katia or Grannoch might evoke images of the seasons or elemental powers.  Martial gods like Toran and Vorax might call upon a warrior's great ire, relentlessness and perseverance.  Goranites might boast that they have improved upon the old methods and invented a new way of channelling power.  Berylites might attribute properties of gemstones to their enhanced spells, like "with the luster of rubies" or the "Strength of diamond".  Vengeful and wrathful gods like Pyrtechon, Corath, Grand and the dark elven gods might evoke traits like spite, wrath, vengeance and profound suffering.  It all depends on the god's dogma and their traits.  Ultimately this is up to the player's RP and their own character's take on the religion that determines how you RP such things.  I wholeheartedly enjoy using extra flavor in casting such boons with added effects as long as they fit the dogma of the religion of the cleric casting them.  Whether it's the eternal love of Ilsare, the virulent spite of Corath or the relentless service of Toran, adding flavor to prayers is a good way to further enhance the RP of the priestly experience.  Kudos to any players who aim to spice up their basic casting of Bioware mechanics with a well thought out and insightful backing based on RP! :)

These sorts of approaches to casting as a cleric help flesh out the world and enhance RP of the class vs. playing them as simple casters who happen to heal.  The priest's relation to the god and how they approach their faith is vital to making a cleric a well fleshed out and well RPed character.  Maybe come up with faith-related rituals when casting the spells, like a Berylite using a type of gem as a focus or a Rofirienite reciting dogmatic law as a somatic component.  A special faith-orientated prayer along the lines of the god's nature for verbal components and even things like the blood of the enemy or a small offering appropriate to the god as RPed material components which dont quite get represented by the game mechanics.  Perhaps you are a mad cultist Corathite who makes use of blood sacrifice to cast, or a Berylite who offers up gemstones for his lady's approval, a Lucindite who evoke's a mage's approach or a Voraxian who instucts his allies in the ways of battle and battle stances as you cast.  I absolutely love such embellishments in the RP of a priest.
 

Nehetsrev

Re: Cleric Meta-Magic
« Reply #8 on: January 22, 2013, 05:16:10 pm »
*Or you could be a Prunillan who summons a walking compost heap, or a scarecrow as guardians of the fields, farms and gardens, and sings silly songs about cooking things like beef stroganof.