Author Topic: Frustrated (Read 3003 times)

havoc · « **on:** March 25, 2007, 02:50:14 pm »

I have to admit I love the new design for the game. Its interesting and exciting. I do also have to say I am beyond frustrated. I spend more time dead then anything else. I cant even get to most low level crafting items. Now you cant even craft while your dead. I don't have the luxury of getting into a group, because I don't have control over how long I can play. I loved this server because I could pop in and pop out and do my crafting and enjoy it. Now.... I just don't have a clue what to do.

I just think you forgot to plan for those of us who by the dictates of RL must spend most of our game time alone.

I don't want to find another server to play on. I like the people here. I like the world and I love the crafting. Its the main appeal of this world. I just wish it were fun to play again.

ShiffDrgnhrt · « **Reply #1 on:** March 25, 2007, 03:03:58 pm »

I'm really sorry to hear this, as I've talked to you about this In Game. Its always nice to see your PC in game. I wish I could help you find Layo as much fun as it was before V3, but... I hope you can solve your dilemma. Would hate to see Sharhar go bye-bye =)

Feel free, however, to find me ingame if your around Vehl, or Hempstead, I can go help you collect things like sand and clay for tinkering. They are safe to get.

anyway, I hope I get to see you ingame still. Goodluck.

Leanthar · « **Reply #2 on:** March 25, 2007, 03:25:59 pm »

Sorry to hear that havoc. Are the encounters too difficult for low level characters? (level 1-6ish or so)? I am not at all happy to hear that things have gotten difficult and that people are not able to play...

but I also request that you take a look around and give it a chance. We had a lot of people when we went from V1 to V2 because of the "difficulty", of which we fixed eventually--it does take time though.

One of my stipulations and major requests for V3 was to allow players to travel alone (easier at least) on the topside of things (except for where cnr is located), more difficult in caves and very difficult in dungeons. If we are still forcing players to travel in parties at lower levels on the topside (and non-cnr) areas (and within reason mind you) then we have more balancing to do.

Dorganath · « **Reply #3 on:** March 25, 2007, 04:46:28 pm »

I would add to what Leanthar is saying by stating that if there are areas which seem to be grossly out of shape, bring them to our attention rather than suffering in silence until the frustration level gets too high.

One last thing: the old places that were closer to Hlint will have gotten more difficult simply because that is no longer a starting area. Rather, look at those areas nearby Port Hempstead and Fort Vehl to see if they are in fact more in line with how things were around Hlint in V2.

Some areas are the way they are for a reason, but for those that are too easy/hard, constructive feedback is our best means of finding and fixing such things.

Praylor Falcus · « **Reply #4 on:** March 25, 2007, 04:55:39 pm »

Sorry to hear your another victim of V3 , while i have tried to point this out to staff before. They seemed obsessed with throwing up in my face my apparent famous solo haven run. Never stopping to ask what i did with all this CNR i supposedly collected. The truth is known by many players like your self whom, because of real life had not the time to RP for hours to form a group, to do some gathering and crafting.
The fact the starter server, and it's purpose as were a character can begin to develop and grow before tackling the more difficult servers (central and east) is lost in the pursuit of the demanded RP of the server. While the fact that higher level characters must now escort lower level characters to obtain CNR that before could be gathered by a small lower level group. Thus further impeding on their time to RP with characters more their level is again lost.
I wish you had been here for V2 as the time required to get a character to a level were they could if forced by the demands of real life or self imposed time to play, could after a few sessions gather CNR with a small (2-3) group. The benches in Hlint were a known meeting place, and one could quickly meet and form such groups.
The V3 while still young and many have yet to adjust to it's complexities, the sad fact of popping in and doing a little crafting to relax after a hard day in RL is a thing of the past, and unless staff is moved by those of you that are affected i fear the shining star of PW's that Layo once was will become lost among the myriad of other servers that stand empty and devoid of the chance to enjoy the interaction that made layo the place i found and loved, The people whom before had time to stop and help, not say Hi as they rush to help a friends new character gather green stone, which at level 4 or 5 they should be able to gather themselves.

EdTheKet · « **Reply #5 on:** March 25, 2007, 05:10:57 pm »

Havoc, thanks for your post, sorry to hear that, if you address Leanthar's questions, we can look and see what we can do.

Praylor,
About this comment:

Quote

The V3 while still young and many have yet to adjust to it's complexities, the sad fact of popping in and doing a little crafting to relax after a hard day in RL is a thing of the past, and unless staff is moved by those of you that are affected

did you even read Leanthar and Dorganath's posts?
And as for your pointing it out to staff, I don't see any Bug Reports or Fixed Bugs started by you addressing this, so if you have issues with certain areas, post them there so that we can look at it instead of unconstructive posts like the above.
Thank you.

Ioskeha · « **Reply #6 on:** March 25, 2007, 05:14:38 pm »

You and I are kind of in the same boat, havoc. The problem I'm having doesn't stem from being able to gather CNR though. Since V3 was released and the hub for role-playing was changed I've found myself no where to go for role-playing anymore while staying in-character. I've never had much luck getting into groups in the past I still at least was able to head somewhere to role-play, and now the changes brought in by V3 my luck getting into parties is basically the same, but my ability to role-play has went away as well... and let me tell you sitting alone with no one to role-play with for hours is very boring. I've been very frustrated about this myself; so much that I haven't logged in and played for a few weeks.

I hope things work out for you, and not end up like me and stop playing..

Kirbiana · « **Reply #7 on:** March 25, 2007, 05:14:38 pm »

One surface area (directly adjacent to Vehl) where neither my Level 5 nor Level 9 PCs feels safe is the road through the mercenaries which leads to the Gloomwood. Going there does not seem to cause a problem, but despite trying to stay strictly on the road on the way back to Vehl, the mercenaries more often than not notice you and follow you through the AT (often long after you think you've made it through safely). Not sure if having an unsafe road is the intention there, but my poor Aeridinite cleric has given up clearing the Gloomwood of undead after having gotten caught and killed there twice. It's a little frustrating, since there's not many places a lower-level Aeridinite can RP their main clerical purpose in life, and the Gloomwood seems as if it should be a nice stepping stone between the Vehl crypts and the much harder crypts of Krandor and Storans.

Leanthar · « **Reply #8 on:** March 25, 2007, 05:15:08 pm »

*shakes head sadly at Praylor* *looks for bug reports by Praylor* Right...I will leave it at that.

@havoc, thank you for posting this. We need to watch for these sort of balancing issues as they are very important to having fun. Please do post the specific areas that are not right in the bug reports as it will help us find things specifically and fix them.

Leanthar · « **Reply #9 on:** March 25, 2007, 05:21:52 pm »

@kirbiana, no...roads are meant to be safe so long as people haven't dragged creatures to it (not much we can do about that)...But roads are supposed to be safe, that is important to allowing traveling and traveling allows grouping (finding) of parties.

No starting area or any area within 5-6 areas of a starting area should be so difficult that it is not workable by a party (4+) of levels 5 or less or soloable by a well built character of level 8 or less. And the intention is to allow soloable situations on the topside of the world (not caves/dungeons) in many of the areas--but within reason and at the appropriate level.

The goal is to turn the areas around fort vehl and port hempstead to be very much like what Hlint used to be (in difficulty)--and in some of the areas EASIER than it was....if that is not the case I need to see some bug reports please.

Acacea · « **Reply #10 on:** March 25, 2007, 06:10:08 pm »

Everyone is still adjusting, both players and developers. To judge concepts because of imperfect executions is hasty. Developers are still fixing spawns or looking at areas, players are still settling into looking for new places instead of expecting old ones to be as they were, and the middle point between the two starting areas is still getting tweaked for people to easily run into.

I do think it would help if the staff did not contradict itself regarding whether or not things are intended for soloing or grouping, when it comes to offering clarity to players.

I just think there is a lot of freaking out and little keeping to the idea that things are still being worked on; the release was not a final 'now we are done, yay!' release, but rather a foundation in a long series rollout.

I dunno about the not finding anyone to RP with. I sat for hours in Hlint. It was almost empty when I was on. I realize it was central and that other times there were many people going in and out, but more often than not it was a ghost town when I was there. I have no doubt whatsoever that the same is the case in the new ones, but in my relatively low playing time I've run into large groups of people hanging out in both starting locations as well as smaller groups at the crossroads between them.

Just post places that are funky; despite arguments that start out over HOW hard something is, or the fact that a large number of the complaints are based on the mistaken assumptions about the intended level range (Haven) or if it's meant to be a main CNR location (Haven, Red Lights), reports are not ignored and still people have to go back and look at them, despite the attitude with which many are brought to attention.

allneal · « **Reply #11 on:** March 25, 2007, 06:19:02 pm »

Quote from: Kirbiana

One surface area (directly adjacent to Vehl) where neither my Level 5 nor Level 9 PCs feels safe is the road through the mercenaries which leads to the Gloomwood. Going there does not seem to cause a problem, but despite trying to stay strictly on the road on the way back to Vehl, the mercenaries more often than not notice you and follow you through the AT (often long after you think you've made it through safely). Not sure if having an unsafe road is the intention there, but my poor Aeridinite cleric has given up clearing the Gloomwood of undead after having gotten caught and killed there twice. It's a little frustrating, since there's not many places a lower-level Aeridinite can RP their main clerical purpose in life, and the Gloomwood seems as if it should be a nice stepping stone between the Vehl crypts and the much harder crypts of Krandor and Storans.

I actually hunted glood wood zombies with a lvl 2-4 justr fine with a ranged weapons and i never attracted teh Merc's attention. This may have been prior too teh 1st V3 fix updatet though. howevr i never ventured much past teh road unless i was in stealth mode.

Ioskeha · « **Reply #12 on:** March 25, 2007, 06:20:03 pm »

Quote from: Acacea

I dunno about the not finding anyone to RP with. I sat for hours in Hlint. It was almost empty when I was on. I realize it was central and that other times there were many people going in and out, but more often than not it was a ghost town when I was there. I have no doubt whatsoever that the same is the case in the new ones, but in my relatively low playing time I've run into large groups of people hanging out in both starting locations as well as smaller groups at the crossroads between them.

It's not that, Acacea. From an role-playing prospective my PC avoids both Port Hempstead and Vehl. My PC would only go there if she had to, and as a last resort. She would not sit around inside either town at all. That's why I said in-character. I know if I go out-of-character that I easily could find people to role-play with.

Lareth · « **Reply #13 on:** March 25, 2007, 06:39:42 pm »

Just wanted to echo ShiffDrgnhrt's comment, feel free to stop my character IG anytime. I know the feeling about popping in for a spot of CNR, it's been one of the best things about this server for me, I'd rather be known as an alchemist or tailor or what have you, than be known as a powerful mage.

Stephen_Zuckerman · « **Reply #14 on:** March 25, 2007, 06:44:23 pm »

Quote from: Ioskeha

It's not that, Acacea. From an role-playing prospective my PC avoids both Port Hempstead and Vehl. My PC would only go there if she had to, and as a last resort. She would not sit around inside either town at all. That's why I said in-character. I know if I go out-of-character that I easily could find people to role-play with.

Now here's a question: If Tornah would avoid those cities, why wouldn't she avoid Hlint, too?

Pen N Popper · « **Reply #15 on:** March 25, 2007, 06:46:31 pm »

V3 is tougher. One problem that is happening to me is that I visit an area (normally with a group as I don't solo), we get pummeled, and that colors my perception both IC and out of it for many RL days. The spawns/difficulty of several areas have been altered (I think) but there's no way I'm going back to check this out.

Crafting was never easy, in my opinion, and each CNR resource had its class that could get it. Now my perception is that only those that can invis can gather at lower levels.

While these are my current perceptions, I also have no doubt things will begin to become "easier" as time goes on and 1) the spawns get adjusted, and probably more important 2) the players figure out how to handle them.

Acacea · « **Reply #16 on:** March 25, 2007, 06:48:18 pm »

Ioskeha - Try the Shack in the crossroads between the two towns. It's not within a cobbled city, just a rural place between them where the guides are supposed to be hired, for hanging out near the stream and campfire and other stuff. Should probably be made a safe rest area. It's still getting settled at the moment I think. I actually think it might as well just be made an actual crossroads that people walk through, rather than hidden away, or have a sign added and the guide lantern be moved outside the area to the place where you turn to get there, so you can see if its lit before going there and seeing for yourself, hehe. But the RP reasons you speak of should be eased there.

havoc · « **Reply #17 on:** March 25, 2007, 06:53:02 pm »

Ok I did not mean to start this huge debate. I was simply frustrated that once again I can not play for the little while I had because I was once agian dead and unable to return to my grave site, and that while before if I ended up dead I could at least craft with what I had in my pack.

I am slow to adjust to huge changes. I loved Hlint area because after 3 years I knew where it was safe and where it wasnt and I had developed a routine that I enjoyed allowing me to progress in small steps and maybe happen into a group to go when i had those rare chances to be online for more than an hour.

I will say that I play a level 9 ranger who is strong for a ranger and has a complex and off center point of view. There is also the fact that rangers are not fighters and like today ... in the Gulf of Bagira the creatures say they are easy.... they are not....

RP and staying true to it is difficult when the world suddenly shifts around you. I have no choice but to go to Port Hamptsed (or what ever its new name is) even though I tended to avoid it before. Hlint was her home and she is afraid of the world at large. She had to suddenly get over her fear of boating because the treants in the forest kept killing her if she took the land route. Its the only crafting hall I can get to so its the only one I can use.

This sounds so petty and third grade whiner. But you cant fix whats wrong if you dont know whats wrong.

these are my notes to myself to learn the new areas and to find what i need and where i can and should not go. THESE ARE ONLY MY OPINIONS and are not a critism or disrespect to anyone..... just to make sure you understood.

from my notes....

Ire Mtns gnolls too tough for me to handle alone.

Ire Mtns 2 Gnolls sneak past them but do not engage.

Path to Ire Mtns bug bear heros..one at a time ... maybe..
worgs lions yes...too bad i cant work lion hide yet...

hepstead fields safe nothing there... cotton. (sometimes)

dirty claw Kobolds great one to one... no CRN

Dapple green Outskirts wolf deer bandit archer... safe

Dapple green II mercenary... maybe.. no more then three

Fort Vehl outskirts... merenary cougar... no more then three is safe. will be nice when i can make cougar leather...

gloom woods safe area..no CRN..ok xp...

deep gloom woods harder but still ok no crn

brech mtns amethyst golom... yeti stragler... brech mtn lacky.... thank goodness for high move silent... no way to survive if seen.

Palden lake safe lots of crn take boat to craft house.

white horn forest usually safe some crn

white horn forest II needed CRN .... Treant .... do not go there.

White horn forest -unicorn.. nothing of note.

goblin cave.. stay away buy salt instead.

those are the areas I have explored and written about so far. I again apologize for turning this into a nag and complain thread. It was not my intention.

havoc · « **Reply #18 on:** March 25, 2007, 07:07:26 pm »

Quote from: Leanthar

*shakes head sadly at Praylor* *looks for bug reports by Praylor* Right...I will leave it at that.

@havoc, thank you for posting this. We need to watch for these sort of balancing issues as they are very important to having fun. Please do post the specific areas that are not right in the bug reports as it will help us find things specifically and fix them.

I do not see this as a bug... its simply ... a case of my character is not strong enough to survive in the new world. I built her to suit me, and like many things in reality... its a rough world out there...

Dorganath · « **Reply #19 on:** March 25, 2007, 08:38:04 pm »

Quote from: havoc

I built her to suit me, and like many things in reality... its a rough world out there...

It is, and to a degree, I share this sentiment, as my own character had trouble with places on West in V2 even past 20th level. He doesn't have the best stats, he's not built for power, he doesn't have the fanciest equipment, but he's interesting, flaws and all. And so perhaps that limits him in some degree, but it also presents opportunities.

Making any grand changes like this, no matter how well we might plan, will always have its greatest test when it's live. Balancing is a process, just as putting something on a scale moves back and forth a bit before settling, so goes the process of balancing things.

If certain areas are vastly too hard (or too easy) for the location and/or intent, we need to know about these areas. Perhaps you're unsure, and that's fine, but if they don't get our attention, they may not be fixed if warranted.

As I said previously, if something seems off, bring it up. At least then you know one way or the other, and perhaps you'll help to make things better for all.