G'ork's WL Items - Possible bug

[Makashi]

When I originally tested the items out I thought they worked correctly, however I had not tried them out on any NPCs - I think it's the same story for both of the items, when used on a player it initiates the rolls , however doesn't seem to be even rolling for NPCs.

Any ideas?

Thanks.

[Makashi]

Thanks to Script Wrecked for getting back to me.

Amulet fully tested and works on both. However still no success on using the helm on a falcon. Unless that bird has immunity to mind spells, or they all had incredibly good will saves...can't see any other reason for failure. - It's not even showing a roll.

However it does when used on player characters.

[Dorganath]

For clarity, you've tested this on both PCs and NPCs and it does work, but certain NPCs do not seem to work?

[Makashi]

Amulet works fine for both.

Hood does not work on NPCs.


Edit: Though I've suddenly thought maybe it doesn't work for creatures including giants etc?

[Script Wrecked]

Thanks to Script Wrecked for getting back to me.

Amulet fully tested and works on both. However still no success on using the helm on a falcon. Unless that bird has immunity to mind spells, or they all had incredibly good will saves...can't see any other reason for failure. - It's not even showing a roll.

However it does when used on player characters.

Falcon != NPC :p

The mind effect only works on dwarves, elves, gnomes, halflings, half-orcs and humans.

Regards,

Script Wrecked.

[Dorganath]

So is it working as intended?

[Script Wrecked]

Yes.

It was modeled on [LORE]Dominate Person[/LORE], which was my understanding of the scope of the ability.

Regards,

Script Wrecked.

[lonnarin]

Also note that such "humanoid only" spells work on the stock player races listed, and not on the NPC based "monstrous humanoids" in game.  For players as the target, the base race counts, not the subrace.  So this item would work on PC goblins & orcs, but not NPC ones.

Perhaps it was an oversight by BioWare when they coded it, since dominate spells should work against orcs, goblinoids, gnolls & lizardmen, but they do not due to monster type categorization.

[Makashi]

Aha makes sense, thanks guys. *shakes fist at bioware, throwing the occasional rock* Thread can be moved/closed ofcourse.

[Hellblazer]

Also note that such "humanoid only" spells work on the stock player races listed, and not on the NPC based "monstrous humanoids" in game.  For players as the target, the base race counts, not the subrace.  So this item would work on PC goblins & orcs, but not NPC ones.

Perhaps it was an oversight by BioWare when they coded it, since dominate spells should work against orcs, goblinoids, gnolls & lizardmen, but they do not due to monster type categorization.

since they have a monstrous skin wouldn't' that fall under hold monsters then?

[Dorganath]

since they have a monstrous skin wouldn't' that fall under hold monsters then?

"Monster" is a racial type, not a skin property. NPCs monsters are generally made with a race out of the list: aberration, animal, beast, construct, dragon, elemental, fey, giant, goblinoid, magical beast, monstrous humanoid, ooze, orc, outsider, reptilian, shapechanger, undead, and vermin. To add confusion, there are also monster classes, but these don't tend to affect spells.

All the PC subrace skin does is apply the racial attribute adjustments and feats and things. It does not change the base race of the PC.  So regardless of the race a PC plays, they would all be affected by Hold Person, Dominate Person and so forth.

[Filatus]

To add confusion, there are also monster classes, but these don't tend to affect spells.

I've only seen this work in the case of banishment I belief, but I'm not 100% sure.

Would actually be interesting to see how the check for HD treats this.

[Hellblazer]

"Monster" is a racial type, not a skin property. NPCs monsters are generally made with a race out of the list: aberration, animal, beast, construct, dragon, elemental, fey, giant, goblinoid, magical beast, monstrous humanoid, ooze, orc, outsider, reptilian, shapechanger, undead, and vermin. To add confusion, there are also monster classes, but these don't tend to affect spells.

All the PC subrace skin does is apply the racial attribute adjustments and feats and things. It does not change the base race of the PC.  So regardless of the race a PC plays, they would all be affected by Hold Person, Dominate Person and so forth.

That explains some thanks dorg. Although I got a question though. Feh is immune to hold persons spells. But he still gets affected by hold monsters. I was wondering if that was right?

[ycleption]

Tieflings have a specific immunity to Charm Person, Dominate Person and Hold Person. As far as I know, its unconnected to the discussion here.
see [lore]tiefling[/lore]

[Hellblazer]

I know what they are immune to, thank you. Just wondering why if a spell is on racial attribute, a spell like hold monsters affect a humanoid?

Although if you want to move this post to the ask a game master, that's fine with me.

[Script Wrecked]

I know what they are immune to, thank you. Just wondering why if a spell is on racial attribute, a spell like hold monsters affect a humanoid?

[LORE]Hold Monster[/LORE]

Note: This spell is not limited to monstrous targets, but will also affect humanoids.

[Dorganath]

Yeah, Hold Monster is like the top of the heap on the Hold spells, likewise for Charm Monster and Dominate Monster.

Since Tieflings have specific spell immunities, that protects them from those spells only but not from the same effect from other spells.  That is different from being immune to hold, paralysis and the like, which are immunities from those effects rather than specific spells.