Do me/us a favor please

[Dorganath]

Four words:

Don't feed the trolls.

He even discounted his own statements by saying later he never actually logged on.  Honestly, I don't believe anything he said....and I doubt anyone else does either.

[Nuzatch]

Wow.  Simply wow.  It has been a REALLY long time since something online actually made me angry.  Like, I wanted to throw something angry.

I'm VERY sorry L, and the rest of the team, that you have to put up with such blatant and utter ignorance, nay, plain stupidity dealing with something you've worked your ASSES off to create.  

At the same time, don't let this shake you, he is obviously either Equi, or a particularly bad troll, and anyone with half a mind is gonna ignore it and see the world that all these people are defending.

[cptoad]

done and done... what a jerk

G

[ExperienceWithStyle]

All right, he got to me a little bit. Already downloaded the HAKs so under any circumstances, when my character is accepted I’m going to check it out.

Instead of going to Bioware’s forum and put fuel on the fire, I will rather ask here, for you to defend his accusation. Perhaps we as possible new members can get a better view of what we are about to enter.

My concerns from DMRage’s post(s):

He mentioned that players are very busy doing quests and fighting. What is the truth in that? Let’s use the following measuring scale: How much of your time is dedicated, evolving your character, in other ways than xp E.G. fight for the fights (xp), questing without adding your own spices to the quest (such as not saying anything else to the NPCs than what is in the option of a programmed dialogue) and time spending around a campfire or in a tavern, talking about the tales, situations and heroes of Layo?

A big area, but not really any content (few NPCs and low variation of placeables)? Is the large scaled mod, created to show long distances or are each area created with a specific use? (hope it makes sense)

Presences of DMs? I have been a DM and mod creator from almost day one of NWN, so I know RL should still be kept in highest priority to avoid a quick burnout…but with the huge amount of DMs, what is the chances on a daily basic to actually interact with one (in form of possessed NPC’s, quests made on the fly etc. Not included is just to spawn a few creatures or anything else the toolset could take care of with some light scripting)?

Favoritism? I know it happens. Of course. And that is how it should be. DMs also just want to have fun, and often fun should be with the ones they know for certain their few hours of gaming is not wasted with…but, if favoritism comes to DMs not having anytime for a new character/player, you are instead wasting the players time. Please explain how it works here (I know it is here, so don’t say; “There is no favoritism” .

All of the above is just of honest concerns of reading that thread. Please lay the concern to rest, but please do it as honest as possible. Better to know now if this is a place for me and perhaps others.

Respectfully

EwS

[RomonaBlack]

Thanks, I thought it would be better to tell a personal opinion of why Layo is so great instead of bantering with him.
-Romona

[Leanthar]

Experiencewithstyle,
  I would suggest you post that in a seperate thread and perhaps link to this thread.  I say that only because it is my guess this thread is starting to die down and because some players will not look in this thread any longer (they have done what they felt needed to be done).  If you post in a new thread I think your valid questions/concerns will be better answered.

[RomonaBlack]

ExperienceWithStyle - 6/9/2005  12:33 PM

All right, he got to me a little bit. Already downloaded the HAKs so under any circumstances, when my character is accepted I’m going to check it out.

Instead of going to Bioware’s forum and put fuel on the fire, I will rather ask here, for you to defend his accusation. Perhaps we as possible new members can get a better view of what we are about to enter.

My concerns from DMRage’s post(s):

He mentioned that players are very busy doing quests and fighting. What is the truth in that? Let’s use the following measuring scale: How much of your time is dedicated, evolving your character, in other ways than xp E.G. fight for the fights (xp), questing without adding your own spices to the quest (such as not saying anything else to the NPCs than what is in the option of a programmed dialogue) and time spending around a campfire or in a tavern, talking about the tales, situations and heroes of Layo?

A big area, but not really any content (few NPCs and low variation of placeables)? Is the large scaled mod, created to show long distances or are each area created with a specific use? (hope it makes sense)

Presences of DMs? I have been a DM and mod creator from almost day one of NWN, so I know RL should still be kept in highest priority to avoid a quick burnout…but with the huge amount of DMs, what is the chances on a daily basic to actually interact with one (in form of possessed NPC’s, quests made on the fly etc. Not included is just to spawn a few creatures or anything else the toolset could take care of with some light scripting)?

Favoritism? I know it happens. Of course. And that is how it should be. DMs also just want to have fun, and often fun should be with the ones they know for certain their few hours of gaming is not wasted with…but, if favoritism comes to DMs not having anytime for a new character/player, you are instead wasting the players time. Please explain how it works here (I know it is here, so don’t say; “There is no favoritism” .

All of the above is just of honest concerns of reading that thread. Please lay the concern to rest, but please do it as honest as possible. Better to know now if this is a place for me and perhaps others.

Respectfully

EwS

First of all I must state that I am not a GM/DM or any high level character but these answers are from my experiences and I hope that it helps you make up your mind.

To your first question:  I personally have found that Layo is primarily the later.  Spending time around the campfire and tavern...etc.  I love the way that people can tell story's and talk about their in-game historie and lives.  I have been able to be a part of at least (seeing as I don't get to game very much) three large RP'ing sessions and many many small ones.  Of course fighting is important too and so is crafting but they are not the primary focus of the world.  Character interaction with RP'ing is what makes this world so wonderful.

To you second question: Yes there are some big areas that do not have a ton of NPC's or enemies but they can be full of crafting ingredients and beauty just like the real world.  Then there are areas that have a ton of NPC's and areas with a ton of enemies, just like the real world.  It creates a sense of realism that you wouldn't normally see with out this set up.  As to placeables there are a lot of placeables, especially in character gathering places to create community and discussion.  Some of the areas are set up to create the illusion of a long distant travel but most of the main cities and towns have a definate purpose and history.

To your third question: I personally have only met three GM's during my gameplay that were in-game as the GM character.  They help with quests yes and any problems that you need to get out of due to game errors or the server going down (which happens very rarely).  Just because they are not in-game as much as their GM characters doesn't mean that they are not part of the game.  Many of them have several other characters that they play that I have met and they have been very helpful.

To your fourth question: I think I might have answered some of your question here with my last answer.  They are always ready to help otherwise they would not have been allowed to me a GM.  There is an application process they have to go through and then they have to be approved through the app by Leanther.  He cares about his world and would not let someone help run it if they didn't care as much as he does.  And I do not think it is as much of favoritism then it just happens to be that they have known some people longer.  Not a problem with me.

Honestly, I have not played other servers but I have found that this world is beautiful and friendly and has a great history to play off of.  I think that you will enjoy it.
Hope this helped.
-RomonaBlack

[ExperienceWithStyle]

Thanks for your reply, RomonaBlack. I appreciate it.

I will also do as you suggested, Leanthar. There can never be too much information.  
 

[Talan Va'lash]

In response to EwS's post:

Whether Rage was ever here or not he started a discussion.  EwS took some of the things rage was ranting about and stated them tactfully.  Here are my answers:

Question 1 -

My interpretation of this question is basically that it boils down to "How much of your IG time do you spend RPing vs striving to gain xp"

My personal answer is that I spend pretty much none of my time doing things motivated by xp.  When I am fighting things either on a quest or otherwise, its often as much an RP event as sitting around telling stories about adventures (gotta get those stories from somewhere.  Most fighting I engage in outside of quests is part of gathering crafting supplies or for exploration (still havent seen the whole world.)  There is a lot of fighting that goes on (especially at lower levels when it is easier to get a largeish party together 4+ chars) but fighting is part (maybe a large part) of the fun and excitement of NWN and PnP D&D, and most parties that go out to fight things have an IC motivation for doing so.  Whether for CNR or their party's ranger has had giants as a favored enemy since level 1 and really hates giants or they're devout Aeridinites and are going to raid a crypt of an ancient lich or something like that (note: all aforementioned motivations are purely made up, though they could concievably happen.)

Question 2 - my blunt interpretation "So I hear the world is big... is it big and empty? or... what?"

Not all the area's are huge and they are all very detailed.  Its not like you're going to be walking down a road surrounded by vast repetetive open plains for 20 minutes.  Layo has the most nicely designed and consistently nice areas I've seen on such a large server.  I don't think there is a single area thats just there to "fill space" or "make it feel big."  The world is acctually a lot smaller than originally intended merely because to house the full world would take... I forget what the estimate was.. something like 16 servers.  Most every wilderness area has something to fight if you're looking for it, 1 or more havestable/minable/skinable things in it, and often a way to avoid fighting said things if you know the way.  Also all the roads (at least on the west server) are scripted to increase your movement speed by 50% when traveling along them so you dont spend as much of your time walking from place to place ("road haste" is not active in central city and town areas.)

Question 3 - "Are DMs around?"

Yes, and yes.  It was some of the tiniest most insignificant DM interactions that solidified my desire to play here some time ago.  There are scheduled events, but just in the last two days there have been some impromptu events involving fighting between the followers of two of the goddesses that resulted in a certain port being captured by pirates.  Over the past month or so a number of DMs have had to step down due to being busy in RL, but new DM applications have already been sent in and interviews are happening currently (I think.)  So, there will be even more DMs soon (yes yes, new DMs, someones accidentally going too hit the pause key I know!)

Question 4 - Favoritism

People are human.  However, I think L and the team do a great job at being as fair as they can and being open to discussion within the community.  If you have an issue you are open to speak with the DMs involved with another DM present if you wish.  I can say that they really are willing to speak to you to try to resolve issues... because... um.. well, I have trouble keeping my mouth shut if I think something is wrong and have had a couple disagreements at times and been able to work them out with whomever was involved.  My only advice about that is to try to talk to or PM the DM involved or Rhizome (DM in charge of grievances, he runs great quests too) or Leanther privately rather than posting straight to the public forums *looks around to see who's staring at him and sheepishly steps down from the podium*

Wow... that was really freakin long.

FIN

[Leanthar]

And a final post from about this thread...I hope.
  Thanks for the support everybody, good job!

[IdiotNoob]

I know you're waiting for this to die down, but I put my two cents in on the bioware forums Leanthar.  Hope that helps.  I doubt people will read that far and mr. angry did his damage, but what the heck.

Hope all is well folks!

[Nuzatch]

"Volrath hits Caern Azyre for 72 Damage..."  Oh I mean uh... hey!

[lonnarin]

As a behavioral scientist, I would rate the social adaptability of Rage/Equinox at a few rungs lower than the psychotic woman on the Simpsons who garbles angry nonsense and throws cats at random people.  At some point in ones interactions with the other entities that compose the communal throng of the outside world, that which exists beyond the self, one should predictably realize that if they are experiencing the same arguments and conflicts they've had in eternal cycles with multiple opponents, most likely the causation stems from the individual; eternally locked in a protective, ineffective schema in some effort to self-validate their own failings and delude them into so-called virtues.

The best definition of insanity is to continually repeat the same actions while expecting different results.  Insantiy is the absence of logic, the self-assured guise of infallibility and the notion that the entire world and cosmos should/does bend to validate your point of view at all times.  The man is insane, he starts the same exact arguments, same threats, lies, ultimatums, each and every server he gets banned from... and then he gets banned and even angrier.  It is as scary as it is pathetically sad.

Notice also the level of deliberate disinformation attached to his "arguments". (more like idle rants, as "argument" implies that there is a viewpoint other than "RRRRAAAAGEEEE!! YOU SUCK YOU SUCK YOU SUCK!!!"  he is trying to support)  One can only drawn one of two conclusions from the amount of outright lying he utilizes as the means for his end.  

1) He is merely offering disinformation to be hostile and knows he's lying, which prevents said action from benefitting him with any notion of self-righteousness.
2) he has become thusly so enraged that he has suffered a complete mental breakdown and has now adopted a delusional alter-reality in which he can protect his prescious emaciated little ego in a cozy little fantasy island where he is always right, no matter how obvious the fact opposing his viewpoint may be.  

In either case scenario, it is highly unlikely that he retains a healthy level of social contacts, interpersonal trust and self-estimation to be allowed to walk the streets among the populace.  His means don't even lead to an end; they are the end in and of themselves.  This is the definition of Hostile Aggression.  (versus instrumental aggression, which is commiting aggressive acts in order to actually reach a goal)

All signs considered, he is a danger to himself and others, as wildly fluctuating levels of hostility and delusion seem to radiate from his mouth and affect the well being of others; possibly on a global basis.  Without any altruistic or mutually beneficial relationships for him to fall back on, this organism will live out the rest of its days alone and very angry.

[freemen2]

heh heh ye loon, if ye got a mini-bar by yer couch am in fer a session

[FlameStrike]

That Rage guy surely needs to get a life, no matter how hard it will be. *sighs and shakes head*

 Leanthar and the Team's devotion to Layo made what we have possible, and everyone with at least minimal brain functionality realize it, but oh well... i guess some people only have fun telling nonsense and lies under a fake name.    

 By the way... i bet 100 gp on how his name isn't Thomas either.

[Force_of_Will_]

I smell Equinox.