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Author Topic: Zero's Rough Pricing Guidelines  (Read 2714 times)

miltonyorkcastle

RE: Zero's Rough Pricing Guidelines
« Reply #60 on: December 13, 2005, 07:25:00 am »
probably not.  but then, clay is not even on the list, mostly because I've seen almost no demand for it.

and of course you wouldn't pay for it, you don't mind getting it yourself.  I know plenty of others (mages in particular) that don't like getting sand and gladly pay the prices.

*grins*  you don't even want to know what I can sell glass for.
 

Ar7

RE: Zero's Rough Pricing Guidelines
« Reply #61 on: December 13, 2005, 09:31:00 am »
Most of the CNR prices depend on how rare they are and how hard they are to get. There are some exceptions and sand is a perfect example. Sand is really easy to get, but the thing that comes into play is time. Few people wish to spend hours digging for sand and that is why they are willing to pay a high price for it (Just as a note, I payed 50gp per bag) This situation is worsened by the fact that one needs A LOT of sand to get any progress in crafting, so the demand and the price grow even more.

So setting a low price, that would be realistic considering the rarity of this resource would simply result in nobody selling it. I think this is an exception that we have to put up with, no other way around it if we want to keep a market that has similar resources for sale.

Other exceptions include eggs, aloe etc.

 

Harloff

RE: Zero's Rough Pricing Guidelines
« Reply #62 on: December 14, 2005, 08:59:00 am »
hmm... you proberbly wouldn't like to know what i am bying glass for then...
 

miltonyorkcastle

RE: Zero's Rough Pricing Guidelines
« Reply #63 on: December 14, 2005, 09:53:00 am »
*chuckles*  at least you're paying for them Harloff.  so many things are simply given away.
 

Harloff

RE: Zero's Rough Pricing Guidelines
« Reply #64 on: January 10, 2006, 05:22:00 am »
I think the lense price on arrows are way to high compared with the prices on weapons and the fact that arrows are used up.
 

Force_of_Will_

RE: Zero's Rough Pricing Guidelines
« Reply #65 on: January 10, 2006, 08:37:00 am »
Dont forget Eggs. I use to pay 2500-3000 for a box.

As for arrows they take a branch of wood and a ingot of metal.
 

Vyris

RE: Zero's Rough Pricing Guidelines
« Reply #66 on: January 10, 2006, 09:50:00 am »
the thing with arrows is the time invested, and the variety of crafts involved.

In oder the make arrows you have to have invested time to harvest the wood, then make the shafts.
You have to mine the metal, smelt it into ingots.
Dig up clay, make molds.
make the ingots into arrow heads
collect feathers
finally assemble the arrows.

I tried making arrows with a character once, it dominated my play time, literaly 80% of my online time was spent making arrows so that I'd have something decent to shoot the other 20%. If someone is willing to invest the time and become proficient in smelting, tinkering and woodworking in order to reliably make the arrows I don't have a problem paying them for the effort.

The fact that arrows get used up doesn't make them less expensive, it means that theres always demand for them. Thats like saying since you have to keep filling your gas tank OPEC should charge less per barrel of oil.

Vyris
 

Stephen_Zuckerman

RE: Zero's Rough Pricing Guidelines
« Reply #67 on: January 10, 2006, 12:44:00 pm »
Eggs. Och... I spent an hour gathering corn, and grinding it into meal, and then dropped it on the ground for the chickens to munch on. I still didn't even get one bloody egg. What's the mechanic for getting the eggs? For feeding the little monsters?
 

Jilseponie Wyndon

RE: Zero's Rough Pricing Guidelines
« Reply #68 on: January 10, 2006, 12:57:00 pm »
You have to feed at least 2 meals per chicken to get an egg.  At least that has been my ratio. The more chikens, the more spread out your meals are.
 

Vyris

RE: Zero's Rough Pricing Guidelines
« Reply #69 on: January 10, 2006, 12:57:00 pm »
I think the most effective strategy is paying someone else 2500-3000 coins to get them for you a box at a time.



*grins*

Vyris
 

Jilseponie Wyndon

RE: Zero's Rough Pricing Guidelines
« Reply #70 on: January 10, 2006, 12:58:00 pm »
You have to feed at least 2 meals per chicken to get an egg.  At least that has been my ratio. The more chickens, the more spread out your meals are.
 

Stephen_Zuckerman

RE: Zero's Rough Pricing Guidelines
« Reply #71 on: January 10, 2006, 01:00:00 pm »
A shame I can't just kill the things, and leave only two or three to eat the meal.
 

Dorganath

RE: Zero's Rough Pricing Guidelines
« Reply #72 on: January 10, 2006, 01:01:00 pm »
And then talk to your chickens...they like a good coversation after a meal. 
  A little encouragement and *pop* out comes the egg.
  And good chicken farmers know how to get just one to come and nibble the corn meal.
 

jrizz

RE: Zero's Rough Pricing Guidelines
« Reply #73 on: January 10, 2006, 03:40:00 pm »
Quote
Vyris - 1/10/2006  9:50 AMthe thing with arrows is the time invested, and the variety of crafts involved.In oder the make arrows you have to have invested time to harvest the wood, then make the shafts.You have to mine the metal, smelt it into ingots.Dig up clay, make molds.make the ingots into arrow headscollect feathersfinally assemble the arrows.I tried making arrows with a character once, it dominated my play time, literaly 80% of my online time was spent making arrows so that I'd have something decent to shoot the other 20%. If someone is willing to invest the time and become proficient in smelting, tinkering and woodworking in order to reliably make the arrows I don't have a problem paying them for the effort.The fact that arrows get used up doesn't make them less expensive, it means that theres always demand for them. Thats like saying since you have to keep filling your gas tank OPEC should charge less per barrel of oil.Vyris

Well said about arrows. The only reason they sell so low is because that is what people are willing to pay for them. So since that is not how things are done here, we should put a pricing guide on arrows and stick to it.


The statment made early about arrows taking only one branch and one ingot is wrong. For 99 arrows you need 5 branches, 5 ingots, 5 feathers, and 5 molds. You need to know how to work wood, metal, and tinker. Sure Hickory shaft copper tipped strige arrows should not cost too much. But oak shaft iron tipped owl arrows should cost quite a bit. It is easier to make a oak long bow then those arrows both in skill (the arrows you have more chances to fail) and in CNR. An oak long bow costs 1500 - 2000, it takes two branches and two silks and you need to know only wood ad sewing. I think we should have some pricing for the below list and that is the rule of cost for arrows. The problem here is that when you get to woods like Yew, I have seen a yew branch go for 5000gp. It takes 5 branches to make 99 arrows so for yew just the cost of the wood would be 25000gp. Of course the amount of damage that yew arrows do is in line with that kind of cost.


Say we take some kind of formula such as (metal cost + wood cost + feather cost) * skill modifier where the skill modifier is based on the wood type.
the below prices are based on the rule of 5 (it takes 5 of each CNR to make 99 arrows)
metal: copper 250gp, bronze 300gp, iron 500gp, plat 2000gp, silver 3750gp, addy 5000gp (guessing on the addy)
wood: hickory 50gp, oak 250gp, mahogany 750gp
feathers: stirge 50gp, falcon 100gp, raven 100gp, owl 200gp
modifier hickory 2, oak 3, mahogany 4.5
(NOTE: did not inculde yew as just the wood needed for 99 arrows alone would be 25000gp)
so
(copper 250 + hickory 50 + falcon 100) * 2 = 800gp/99 arrows
(iron 500 + oak 250 + raven 100) * 3 = 2550gp/99 arrows
(iron 500 + mahogany 750 + owl 200) * 4.5 = 6225gp/99 arrows
 
 

Guardian 452

RE: Zero's Rough Pricing Guidelines
« Reply #74 on: January 10, 2006, 03:47:00 pm »
The pricing is sound but no one in their right mind will throw away that much money on arrows.

A skilled archer will go thru a quiver of arrows in 10 minutes or less.... no way will they fork over 60k plus for 10 quivers of mahogany arrows for their next outing.

I agree that a price guide should be made for arrows ... but honestly they are next to impossible to put a "fair price" on that people will actually pay and that the crafters will be happy with.

Thus almost anyone who does make arrows makes them for personal use.
 

jrizz

RE: Zero's Rough Pricing Guidelines
« Reply #75 on: January 10, 2006, 03:59:00 pm »
yep that is the issue :), but as you stated the pricing is sound based on CNR and skill so if we agree to this and stick to it, it will be the rule :) if one wants arrows that do more damage then they will pay for them or go through all the work needed to make them. As some other players have stated and I have said so myself it takes a long time to gather everything needed and the craft a bunch of arrows.

I also included the bump in value due to the advanced cert needed to make mahogany arrows.


10 quivers of mahogany arrows is 1000 arrows. It takes 50 branches alone to make that many and depending on the metal used will deal great amounts of damage. It could be argued that 60k is not that much to pay. Also there are ways to bring the price down like collecting the CNR needed or trading something of like value (rods, rings...). 
 

osxmallard

RE: Zero's Rough Pricing Guidelines
« Reply #76 on: January 10, 2006, 04:19:00 pm »
Is it possible to add an arrow "drop" to dead creatures so that some arrows (based on their quality - wood/tip) are able to be "recycled"?  Arrows should be good for more than one use -- perhaps a percentage of the arrows used to kill a creature could be reclaimed.  (example: 75% of yew, 50% mahog, 25% oak, 0% regular, etc.)  This could make the cost of making/purchasing these arrows worthwhile to both the crafter and the user.
 

jrizz

RE: Zero's Rough Pricing Guidelines
« Reply #77 on: January 10, 2006, 04:54:00 pm »
Cool idea but the scripting might be hard. You would have to keep count of the arrow hits and then apply the modifier for reuse. and that would be per bad guy. It would be easier to track how many arrows were shot by a character and then return some percentage back the the quiver after combat mode.
 

Guardian 452

RE: Zero's Rough Pricing Guidelines
« Reply #78 on: January 10, 2006, 06:49:00 pm »
I see no point in trying to make those prices "the rule" its too much to pay for a consumable item.
 

jrizz

RE: Zero's Rough Pricing Guidelines
« Reply #79 on: January 10, 2006, 08:46:00 pm »
to continue the discussion :) potions and scrolls are consumable also but some of them are quite pricey. You may argue that the components that go into some potions (haste, invisi) are hard to get and costly. Well I think we have already seen that the components that go into a bunch of arrows at the top end can also be hard to get and costly. So if the prices that are based on the components and skill to make are too high then the same should hold true for potions and scrolls. 

I am enjoying this debate, I hope we can come to a solution that makes sense.
 

 

anything