The World of Layonara  Forums

Author Topic: prolly a dumb question  (Read 111 times)

blinds21

  • Jr. Member
  • **
    • Posts: 148
      • View Profile
    prolly a dumb question
    « on: March 03, 2006, 02:58:28 am »
    I am pretty sure this won't get allowed, but I thought I'd plead on hands and knees anyway. I was wondering if a DM could sub me out and let me repick my 8th level again. I totally misplaced my ability points and now I can't go weapon master.

    If not, it's cool. just thought I'd beg.
     

    orth

    Re: prolly a dumb question
    « Reply #1 on: March 03, 2006, 03:04:27 am »
    Read this post to see if you are entitled to request a rebuild/relevel:
    http://www.layonaraonline.com/forums/forums/thread-view.asp?tid=15665

    Then follow the instructions here to request one.
    http://www.layonaraonline.com/forums/forums/thread-view.asp?tid=14402
     

    blinds21

    • Jr. Member
    • **
      • Posts: 148
        • View Profile
      Re: prolly a dumb question
      « Reply #2 on: March 03, 2006, 05:17:25 am »
      it's not really worth a rebuild. it took me a month to get where I am at. I'll just wait.

      weapon master aint all that great from what I read anyway, i just want whirlwind.

      Thank you though. :-D
       

      typically_annoying

      • Jr. Member
      • **
        • Posts: 104
          • View Profile
        Re: prolly a dumb question
        « Reply #3 on: March 03, 2006, 05:20:46 am »
        a rebuild doesn't mean start from L1 ... if approved they can roll your xp back to L7 and re-add the xp, so you can fix your mistakes.  it is well known you wanted WM, so if a genuine mistake it may (or may not) get approved.  you have nothing to lose by trying!
         

        blinds21

        • Jr. Member
        • **
          • Posts: 148
            • View Profile
          RE: prolly a dumb question
          « Reply #4 on: March 03, 2006, 05:42:56 am »
          Thanks Typic, I filed for one. I used you as a witness cause your char is my char's trainer and knows him best concerning the matter.
           

          osxmallard

          RE: prolly a dumb question
          « Reply #5 on: March 03, 2006, 08:02:07 am »
          Actually, I think that Weapon Master is that great, and whirlwind isn't.

          Whirlwind is fun to use... but it only really works against lower level enemies since you can be surrounded by
          them and not take huge amounts of damage while taking them out with 2-3 attacks.  When you get to the
          harder opponents that surround you, it is more of a "last ditch effort" to hope you survive bringing too many
          enemies at the same time and would probably not be used (since you give up the other attacks that round
          when you use it).

          WM is not "great" at the lower levels, but when you hit level 5 in WM and bump your critical to x3 from x2, etc.
          you can start dealing massive damage with criticals.  Combined with Improved Critical, it can be devastating.
          Further, when you get to level 7 in WM, your critical threat range goes up +2 as well, effectively making a
          WM w/ Rapier have a critical range of (14-20?) with Imp Crit and WM 7.  That's hitting (bad math may occur
          here) about 40% of the time with a x3 critical hit.  Ouch!

          There are disadvantages as well... you are giving up the fighter bonus feats (if you were a fighter) while you
          take the levels in WM (since only epic WM's get bonus feats) and the first few levels give you very minor
          benefits (Ki Damage, etc.)

          I'd love to hear from the more experienced WM's out there to see if I am totally wrong...
           

          blinds21

          • Jr. Member
          • **
            • Posts: 148
              • View Profile
            RE: prolly a dumb question
            « Reply #6 on: March 03, 2006, 08:37:19 am »
            You make a good point Osx. I would like to hear from experienced WMs too.
             

            Weeblie

            RE: prolly a dumb question
            « Reply #7 on: March 03, 2006, 09:18:35 am »
            Quote
            osxmallard - 3/3/2006  5:02 PM

            Actually, I think that Weapon Master is that great, and whirlwind isn't.

            Whirlwind is fun to use... but it only really works against lower level enemies since you can be surrounded by
            them and not take huge amounts of damage while taking them out with 2-3 attacks.  When you get to the
            harder opponents that surround you, it is more of a "last ditch effort" to hope you survive bringing too many
            enemies at the same time and would probably not be used (since you give up the other attacks that round
            when you use it).

            WM is not "great" at the lower levels, but when you hit level 5 in WM and bump your critical to x3 from x2, etc.
            you can start dealing massive damage with criticals.  Combined with Improved Critical, it can be devastating.
            Further, when you get to level 7 in WM, your critical threat range goes up +2 as well, effectively making a
            WM w/ Rapier have a critical range of (14-20?) with Imp Crit and WM 7.  That's hitting (bad math may occur
            here) about 40% of the time with a x3 critical hit.  Ouch!

            There are disadvantages as well... you are giving up the fighter bonus feats (if you were a fighter) while you
            take the levels in WM (since only epic WM's get bonus feats) and the first few levels give you very minor
            benefits (Ki Damage, etc.)

            I'd love to hear from the more experienced WM's out there to see if I am totally wrong...


            The main reason for using whirlwind isn't the damage dealt.

            No, it's because of the animation. It's just... cool. ;)
             

            Acacea

            RE: prolly a dumb question
            « Reply #8 on: March 03, 2006, 09:41:49 am »
            "Shop smart, shop Derrick-Mart! We're slllaaaashing prices! Har! *Whirlwind*"
             

            s0ulz

            Re: prolly a dumb question
            « Reply #9 on: March 03, 2006, 09:47:38 am »
            I think that given what WM gives with only 7 levels is more than enough. WM deals as much damage in as short a period as possible, while a class like DD puts more pressure on survivability. Fighters with 7 WM levels will deal huge damage, but don't think you're all god after that ;) Layonara is not the OC, survivability is a huge factor here.
             

            typically_annoying

            • Jr. Member
            • **
              • Posts: 104
                • View Profile
              RE: prolly a dumb question
              « Reply #10 on: March 03, 2006, 09:54:37 am »
              Quote
              osxmallard - 3/3/2006  4:02 PM

              Actually, I think that Weapon Master is that great, and whirlwind isn't.

              Whirlwind is fun to use... but it only really works against lower level enemies since you can be surrounded by
              them and not take huge amounts of damage while taking them out with 2-3 attacks.  When you get to the
              harder opponents that surround you, it is more of a "last ditch effort" to hope you survive bringing too many
              enemies at the same time and would probably not be used (since you give up the other attacks that round
              when you use it).

              WM is not "great" at the lower levels, but when you hit level 5 in WM and bump your critical to x3 from x2, etc.
              you can start dealing massive damage with criticals.  Combined with Improved Critical, it can be devastating.
              Further, when you get to level 7 in WM, your critical threat range goes up +2 as well, effectively making a
              WM w/ Rapier have a critical range of (14-20?) with Imp Crit and WM 7.  That's hitting (bad math may occur
              here) about 40% of the time with a x3 critical hit.  Ouch!

              There are disadvantages as well... you are giving up the fighter bonus feats (if you were a fighter) while you
              take the levels in WM (since only epic WM's get bonus feats) and the first few levels give you very minor
              benefits (Ki Damage, etc.)

              I'd love to hear from the more experienced WM's out there to see if I am totally wrong...


              Totally right .. it's only past L7 that it gets really cool and you lose an awful lot of feats because of it.  The feats you would miss taking, probably wont help you kill any quicker (except 2-h fighting) but they sure could protect you better and make you a more rounded character.  Everyone always overlooks the Barbarian/Fighter .. a potentially uber-class with huge life, dr, extra strength .. can go head-to-head with the WM any-day i would say.  To be honest, most of us build WM's wrong .. they should be about dual-wielding weapons that have huge crit-range and using devastating critical .. that is what WM's are really about --->  Hit! Crit! Crit! Hit! Crit! Crit! Crit! Crit! Crit! oh, and Hit! again.

              Whirlwind is a cool feat and looks great.  Very useful for standing in the middle of pack of ogres!  But, I dont think anyone would realisitically get it if it wasn't for WM.  Hmmm .. unless you had a weapon with some sort of effect like stun .. then WW would be extremely useful.  Expertise!  Now that is an awesome feat!  So useful!

              But, all this said, WM adds to the RP value of your character.  A fighter is a fighter, no real RP required.  The WM needs dedication and training.  It's like playing a Ranger, it's all about the RP.
               

              Eight-Bit

              Re: prolly a dumb question
              « Reply #11 on: March 03, 2006, 09:57:36 am »
              Well, let's do the math a bit. We'll say this hypothetical little Weapon Master has a Rapier or a Scimitar; or Kukri's for you nifty little buggers that want to look cute. All of these weapons have the same critical threat range of 18-20 without any feats or bonuses. When you apply the Improved Critical feat to them they become 15-20. That's a possible 30% chance of a critical hit. When you factor in the possibility of reaching level 7 in your weapon master journey it will be 13-20. If you have a helpful mage around to cast Keen Edge? Well, that's a whopping 10-20. Or 55% of your attacks will be a critical, should you make the threat roll.

              Wow. All of this number crunching really makes me want to bring Phalleugh back, but then again I got bored with him pretty quickly. Mostly because he was all about the numbers. Hah. I know this is starting to sound generic here, but I really do mean it this time: if you're going to play a Weapon Master you should be sure it's necessary for the character's personality and style of roleplaying. I'm still convinced that a pure-blooded Fighter has the total advantage, just because they're able to handle more situations because of their collection of feats and what not.

              I agree with the posts above. Who really needs to be dealing 60-70 damage on 55% percent of your six attacks a round because you're an adorable little bugger with bendy knives who likes to hack away needlessly at a horde of mindless enemies?

               

              Talan Va'lash

              Re: prolly a dumb question
              « Reply #12 on: March 03, 2006, 10:04:54 am »
              Quote
              Eight-Bit - 3/3/2006  10:57 AM

              I agree with the posts above. Who really needs to be dealing 60-70 damage on 55% percent of your six attacks a round because you're an adorable little bugger with bendy knives who likes to hack away needlessly at a horde of mindless enemies?



              Lol!  is this an argument pro or con? ;P
               

              Eight-Bit

              Re: prolly a dumb question
              « Reply #13 on: March 03, 2006, 10:18:24 am »
              Quote
              Talan Va'lash - 3/3/2006  1:04 PM

              Quote
              Eight-Bit - 3/3/2006  10:57 AM

              I agree with the posts above. Who really needs to be dealing 60-70 damage on 55% percent of your six attacks a round because you're an adorable little bugger with bendy knives who likes to hack away needlessly at a horde of mindless enemies?



              Lol!  is this an argument pro or con? ;P


              Oh. By the way, I hope everyone knows I am calling the Halfling Kukri using Weapon Master come NWN2. I called it! You can't un-call it!
               

              Rayenoir

              • Full Member
              • ***
                • Followers of Rofirein
                • Followers of Xeen
              • Posts: 608
                • View Profile
              Re: prolly a dumb question
              « Reply #14 on: March 03, 2006, 12:30:36 pm »
              NWN2 will be 3.5 rules.  3.5 no longer has the Weapon Master as a prestige class.

              And on another note... for the record, there are some crazy Fighter/Wizards out there that will deliberately wade with 50% concealment and 20/+3 DR into a mass of enemies, and that makes whirlwind glorious. ;)
               

              darkwulf365

              Re: prolly a dumb question
              « Reply #15 on: March 03, 2006, 01:26:50 pm »
              Quote
              Rayenoir - 3/3/2006  3:30 PM

              NWN2 will be 3.5 rules.  3.5 no longer has the Weapon Master as a prestige class.

              And on another note... for the record, there are some crazy Fighter/Wizards out there that will deliberately wade with 50% concealment and 20/+3 DR into a mass of enemies, and that makes whirlwind glorious. ;)


              Those are the same crazy fighter/mages that drive clerics crazy because they use a 2-handed weapon that's bigger than their character, and *always* stand in the fight too long and make the cleric sweat bullets hoping I...I mean *they* can pass a concentration check to cast a Heal