The World of Layonara

The Layonara Community => Just for Fun => Topic started by: lunchboxkilla on December 05, 2006, 05:06:50 AM

Title: Calling all 40K and starwars nerds..
Post by: lunchboxkilla on December 05, 2006, 05:06:50 AM

I'm having one huge argument with a friend at work...

Firstt part of the fight.

A chapter librian could Crush a jedi


second fight

A full battle fleet of Imperal stary destroyers with support  (yes we'll add the super star destroyer, if you read the books there was 5 beofor vader lost his in return of the jedi )VS a full Imperal Battle barge bregade with support.


What we agreed on

Death star: no contest... Extermanutis cannons would rip it to shreads

PLEASE DON'T TURN THIS INTO A FLAME WAR
lets be civil

Title: Re: Calling all 40K and starwars nerds..
Post by: Stephen_Zuckerman on December 05, 2006, 12:45:02 PM

It depends on the jedi, honestly, but you're probably right on that.

Title: Re: Calling all 40K and starwars nerds..
Post by: LordCove on December 05, 2006, 12:49:41 PM

Depend's which side Wedge is fighting on

Title: Re: Calling all 40K and starwars nerds..
Post by: Creighton on December 05, 2006, 01:43:12 PM

I have to agree with Stephen...depends on the Jedi.

Title: Re: Calling all 40K and starwars nerds..
Post by: darkstorme on December 05, 2006, 03:07:06 PM

I'd say if it were Kyp, he'd win.  Regardless, there were indeed five SSDs active by the time Endor rolled around.. what were their names? :)

Title: Re: Calling all 40K and starwars nerds..
Post by: Creighton on December 05, 2006, 03:58:19 PM

Gods...my Star Wars geekhood is compromised!!!

Title: Re: Calling all 40K and starwars nerds..
Post by: Laldiien on December 05, 2006, 04:49:02 PM

I once got into this same type of arguement with a friend, only it was Star Trek:TNG vs Star Wars Death Star. We finally came to an amicable agreement. (I had Collectors box Han Solo and I wasn't giving it back until he said I was right)

Title: Re: Calling all 40K and starwars nerds..
Post by: Creighton on December 05, 2006, 04:55:11 PM

Only with the quantum torpedoes that they used against the Borg in First Contact would the Enterprise have a chance...

...unless you're talking the NCC-1701 Constitution class with Kirk in the center seat...he could out-think Vader and Tarkin any day of the week...

Title: Re: Calling all 40K and starwars nerds..
Post by: lunchboxkilla on December 05, 2006, 05:16:04 PM

A gothic battle barge alone is miles long More guns then any thing, Warp jump, shields that won't let fighters fly into the bridge, Extermanutis array, one full chapter of space marines... Heck get a thunder hawk near a Star destroyer and do a borading action and its like imperal guard VS marine with no support. onve they get the dock taken over they could seeing that a SD has huge hall ways get a dreadnought into it and boom over.

The jedi thing...
Can a jedi's light saber block plasma or 20mm rocket propell 20mm slugs?

Title: Re: Calling all 40K and starwars nerds..
Post by: Laldiien on December 05, 2006, 05:25:32 PM

Poor, misguided soul. Two words: Warp Strafing. AS the Death Star (or as I like to call it "Big Round EM Signature") is a sublight velocity craft in combat, *and* it has been established that the Enterprise can both launch and propel photorps at FTL speeds, the BREMS would be torn to shreds. I will conceed that if the Enterprise were to stay still, i.e.; relative stop, the main gun would eat it for lunch. But that's just silly.
 
  I have just used all my accumulated cool points for the last three years.

Title: Re: Calling all 40K and starwars nerds..
Post by: Creighton on December 05, 2006, 05:30:48 PM

*smiles*

Standard photorps are comparable to the proton torpedoes used by the x-wing squadron that first reached the thermal exahaust port on the Death Star...and we saw how negligible of an effect they had....in the meantime, phasers would be ineffective, as the whole of the DS was ray-shielded....again, why I said with the quantum torpedoes, the Enterprise would have a MUCH better shot.

...and at least you HAD cool points....:P

Title: Re: Calling all 40K and starwars nerds..
Post by: lunchboxkilla on December 05, 2006, 05:48:00 PM

Quote

Laldiien - 12/5/2006  8:25 PM    Poor, misguided soul.  Two words:  Warp Strafing.  AS the Death Star (or as I like to call it "Big Round EM Signature") is a sublight velocity craft in combat, *and* it has been established that the Enterprise can both launch and propel photorps at FTL speeds, the BREMS would be torn to shreds.  I will conceed that if the Enterprise were to stay still, i.e.; relative stop, the main gun would eat it for lunch.  But that's just silly.
   
  I have just used all my accumulated cool points for the last three years.

 did ya forget starfleet protocalls calls for Peaceful means...   HEehhehehe Piccard  "this is the Starship Enterprise, we come in peace" Calgar of the Ultramarines "FOR THE EMPIPOR!"

Title: RE: Calling all 40K and starwars nerds..
Post by: Honora on December 05, 2006, 05:58:24 PM

Oh, please.  The Prime Directive hasn't applied to anything the Enterprise did since Kirk first realized that aliens could have XX chromosomes too.

Title: RE: Calling all 40K and starwars nerds..
Post by: Laldiien on December 05, 2006, 06:00:14 PM

hehe.....and she's alll mine! I got's me a girl-geek!

Title: Re: Calling all 40K and starwars nerds..
Post by: Creighton on December 05, 2006, 06:01:57 PM

*bows respectfully*

:)

Title: Re: Calling all 40K and starwars nerds..
Post by: cbnicholson on December 06, 2006, 10:27:31 AM

"hehe.....and she's alll mine!   I got's me a girl-geek!" now those are hard to find..  *goes off grumbling about a girl geek shortage *

Title: Re: Calling all 40K and starwars nerds..
Post by: CHAzz on December 06, 2006, 12:30:08 PM

now don't forget the relatively small number of individuals who are force sensitive, and the even fewer of those who become proficient in its use in Star Wars, versus the number of interstellar races with psychic abilities in Star Trek.

Title: Re: Calling all 40K and starwars nerds..
Post by: darkstorme on December 06, 2006, 03:45:44 PM

Quote

lunchboxkilla - 12/5/2006  8:16 PM

A gothic battle barge alone is miles long More guns then any thing, Warp jump, shields that won't let fighters fly into the bridge, Extermanutis array, one full chapter of space marines... Heck get a thunder hawk near a Star destroyer and do a borading action and its like imperal guard VS marine with no support. onve they get the dock taken over they could seeing that a SD has huge hall ways get a dreadnought into it and boom over.

The jedi thing...
Can a jedi's light saber block plasma or 20mm rocket propell 20mm slugs?

Have you PLAYED Republic Commando?  I don't care what's in the way.  The Deltas will take it out.

And the Jedi doesn't NEED to use his lightsaber.  That's convenient for those who are lazy or of lower power, but Vader (and those on Dathomir) could block blaster bolts with their bare hands, and absorb energy weapon fire.  As for physical weapons, we saw in Splinter of the Mind's Eye that Vader could stop bullets with the Force, and we saw from Clone Wars that Yoda could turn rockets back on their sources.  Ergo, Jedi wins.

Title: Re: Calling all 40K and starwars nerds..
Post by: lunchboxkilla on December 07, 2006, 04:58:56 AM

I have played commando. Have you read into the warhammer 40K stories?

The 10 main battle cannons on one gothic battle bardge hold rounds that take 100 people to load, people who have been born onto that ship and will die with it. its their home, they never knew what it was like to have sky over their head or earth under their feet. the shall from oen battle cannon is roughtly the size of big ben are ment to tear asunder armor once the secondary guns have ripped the shileds apart. As for a Space marine.... His armor is men to withstand lascannons from impreal guard, slamm arms fire and even a few IEDs. his body is transformed from a normal human into a 500+ year battle vetrian where as clones are rushed at birth slapped on some armor and handded a laster blaster. I have a few stories where Marines lost arms legs broken backs missing eyes and they still fought on. One story A marine lost a fraction of his skull and still battled on.

A chapter Librian is the oldest Librian (think Tigrius form ultra marines) they can crush some one's mind with otu even seeing them. Tear holes in the space fabric and launch energies of the warp. Vaider's hands were machines...what would say he has reflective armor in his hands seeing that Laser based weapons were very common? And no I'm not pulling yoda or vader or any of the movie jedi out.. I'm saying some jedi that was just there.

Once borading  is on, I don't think a Tactial squad could hold back 1000 heavly trained ready to die 8-9 foot tall super humans that will not feel pain have no fear and mercy. They would blow holes in the hull to distract while the main borading party would invade or they would simply just ram a fighter into the bridge


I haven't seen the deltas do hand to hand with some one that is wearing terminator armor and a power fist.

Title: Re: Calling all 40K and starwars nerds..
Post by: lunchboxkilla on December 08, 2006, 05:09:35 AM

If you want to pull out vader or yoda I'll pull out The Empiror of man kind. Basic human... No gentic splicing.. Removed hours's soul with a though after he killed his brother.

Title: Re: Calling all 40K and starwars nerds..
Post by: Laldiien on December 08, 2006, 05:34:47 AM

You good folk realize the sheer amount of geekiness eminating from this thread is liable summon the Dark Nerd. His slide rule has slain thousands of ideas, while his pocket protector serves as a spring for all things nerdy. No, do not summon the Dark Nerd. Quick, someone make a reference to a sport event involving large men that grunt.

Full contact chess does not count.

Title: Re: Calling all 40K and starwars nerds..
Post by: lunchboxkilla on December 08, 2006, 08:06:14 PM

I could repost the specs of my rig again

Title: Re: Calling all 40K and starwars nerds..
Post by: darkstorme on December 11, 2006, 12:36:38 AM

Removed who's soul with a what?  And the power of a Jedi depends highly on which book series you're in.  Betcha the Siiruuvi would have a real use for the "Emperor of Mankind".

Title: Re: Calling all 40K and starwars nerds..
Post by: CHAzz on December 11, 2006, 11:19:06 AM

and unltimately the followers of Chaos and the Dark Eldar appear, drawn by the epic fighting and massive amounts of psychic energy being unleashed, and start fighting everybody for the sheer heck of it, thus confusing the issue even more.......and after that, the Tyranids move in and eat everybody left on all sides.

Title: Re: Calling all 40K and starwars nerds..
Post by: lunchboxkilla on December 12, 2006, 03:01:37 AM

Siiruuvi a human?

The Emperor would of been liked "Sure I'll join you" and as soon as Siiruuvi turned around he would of put a power claw through his heart.

Chaos is weak, followers of Saleenish is weak
 'Nids invented zerg rushing

Title: Re: Calling all 40K and starwars nerds..
Post by: CHAzz on December 12, 2006, 01:00:52 PM

yes but with the ability to turn entire worlds into hybrids and their cultists, and rapidly I might add, they've got nigh-unlimited troops....and they are all hungry

Title: Re: Calling all 40K and starwars nerds..
Post by: lunchboxkilla on December 13, 2006, 04:38:38 AM

Please.... When the Emperor walked the chapeters were legons, 10,000+ marines, 14 chapters, 1000 Marines could take a planet in weeks.
Add the millions if not billions of Imperal guard, The machine cult, The titans, +100 more battle barges with full extermanutis arrays. Frigates, Moble space fortresses 8 of them. Any Imperal human loyal to his name armed (another billion billion)

Title: Re: Calling all 40K and starwars nerds..
Post by: CHAzz on December 13, 2006, 11:59:07 AM

don't forget also, that the Jedi are trained to limit their manipulation of the Force, while psykers could care less if their actions are viewed as "good" or "bad"

Title: Re: Calling all 40K and starwars nerds..
Post by: lunchboxkilla on December 13, 2006, 06:00:05 PM

*just grins*

Title: Re: Calling all 40K and starwars nerds..
Post by: Fatherchaos on December 13, 2006, 06:49:40 PM

It only takes one flying space monkey! *had to drop in, this thread is like a regenerating cheese log to me - it just begs to be bitten!*

Title: Ok some hard facts for the ST
Post by: Jerek Adams on November 27, 2013, 05:37:53 AM

Ok some hard facts for the ST guys from the CREATORS and INTELLECTUAL PROPERTY OWNERS of your universe.

Power output from a phaser bank for a sovereign class starship from the feds = 5.75MW as stated by the universe OWNERS!  There are 15 of these.  For a total output of 86.25MW.  Or about 1/17th the output of a modern day 1500MW nuclear power plant.  Photon torpedos with a yield of 64MT or 12MT larger than the most powerful nuclear device already detonated by man at 52MT.  This is startin to look bleak.

Now for 40K vs. Star wars.  I will compare the differences between the Imperium of Man and the Galactic Empire at its Hieght.

Alright time for some real world stats provided by Lucas Arts and Sir Isaac Newton. 

 

Star destroyer. 8MT per turbolaser blast (lucas arts) multiplied by 60 turbolasers on an class 1 Imperial SD. A total output of 8 x 60 = 480MT / salvo. That's pretty devastating. (for the lols the enterprise e only emits 5.75MW per phaser bank). 

 

First, Nova cannon. Bore is 50m. Fires its round at .95c or 95% the speed of light. Most battleships rounds (in real life) are 20 times longer than the bore of their gun. 

 

So 50m x 20 = 1000m or 1 km (that's okay a nova cannon is 3.5 km long and the cruisers that carry them are 3.5 km long. Larger vessels carry them as well. 

 

Volume of a cylinder 50m in diameter by 1000m long. V = (pie/4) x d(squared) x length. V= (3.14/4) x 50m(sq) x 1000m. V = .7854 x 2500m(sq.) x 1000m = 1 963 500 cu meters. Or in km 1.964 cu kilometers. 

 

Mass = density per cubic meter x cubic meters = 7850kg/cu. m x 1 963 500cu. m = 1.54 x 10 to 10th or 15 400 000 000kg. I used the density of steel although the round is loaded with plasma warheads which are likely lighter than steel but the adamantium casing is far far far heavier. So say a wash (although I may be understating by quite a margin). 

 

95% speed of c = 186 000 mi/s x .95 = 176 700mi/s. or 282 720km/s or 282 720 000m/s. 

 

E(kinetic) = 0.5 x mass x velocity(sq.) = 0.5 x 15 400 000 000kg x 282 720 000m/s (sq.). = 6.155x10 to the 26th Joules! Or 615 500 000 000 000 000 000 000 000 Joules. Or 615 yotta-joules. 

 

One tonne of TNT = 4.184GJ or 4 184 000 000 Joules. So 615 500 000 000 000 000 000 000 000 / 4 184 000 000 = 1.47 x 10 to the 17th tonnes of TNT. Or 147 000 000 000 000 000 tonnes. Or 147 peta-tonnes. 

 

Now the blast of this round is much worse and takes out an approx. blast radius of 3500km. The plasma warheads are far worse than the kinetic energy but I remember a GW fluff (Which I can't recall) saying it was 2.5 times stronger than the kinetic energy of the round. 

 

So. 147 petta-tonnes x 2.5 = 367.5 + 147 = 514.5 peta-tonnes. Per shot. Every 30 minutes. 

 

An Imperium cruiser can soak 2 rounds resulting in destruction, that's right, 2 of these rounds! So a durability of lets say 1 exa-tonne but really its 1.029 exa-tonnes. 

 

Star destroyer fires 480MT / volley. So in tonnes 1 029 000 000 000 000 000 / 480 000 000 = 2 143 750 000 volleys from a single SD to destroy a cruiser. Said cruisers that conservatively number in the hundreds of thousands for the Imperium of Man. 

 

Lets throw all 35 000 SD of the Imperial fleet at that one cruiser! So 2 143 750 000 volleys / 35 000 SD = 61 250 entire fleet volleys! This means the ENTIRE Imperial fleet has to fire 61 250 volleys to destroy this cruiser! 

 

Say they can fire every 5 seconds. 60 / 5 = 12 volleys / min. So 61 250 volleys / 12 volleys/min. = 5104.166667 minutes / 60 minutes per hour = 85.06944445 hours / 24 hours/day = 3.545 days. Of constant firing with no losses. 

 

Now 8MT turbolasers are a threat to capital ships in SW. So the nova cannon itself will shred them, and the broadside of a cruiser is a low tera-tonne yield event which also shreds them. Now we can name the flagship of this campaign "The Shredder". 

 

One IOM cruiser could wrap all of the empires SD's. At it's height. A SD has 60 heavy guns, an IOM cruiser has 3000+. 

 

So know that we have official numbers from star wars that cannot be disputed as the BELONG TO THE INTELLECTUAL PROPERTY OWNERS AND THEY OVERIDE EVERY FANBOYS BASELESS STATEMENT REGARDING THOSE STATS, well its a wrap. IOM for the curbstomping. 

 

The empire is outnumbered, outgunned, and outlasted in all categories. That nova cannon can slag DS II, one shot! Psykers will demolish the force users, and Alpha+ class can destroy planets, instantly with a thought. A lasgun will punch basketball holes in unarmored flesh, an unarmored blaster wound is survivable as seen with Leia on Endor's Century Moon. The God Emperor banishes souls from all time and existence as if they were never there. Sorry Palp's and Kun. IOM FTW.

Title: LOL... that was some serious
Post by: Ravemore on November 27, 2013, 02:06:28 PM

LOL... that was some serious thread necromancy.