Introducing Temple Donations

[Shadowblade225]

Try 95% percent

Or am I just insane?  But yes, clerics, paladins, and champions of a specific faith should significantly contribute as best they can to their respective temples, which will mean that they sadly will not be as financially competitive within the trade and market hall. My suggestion? Begin to worship your dicebag just as much as your PC worships his/her god so you have a greater chance of getting high dice rolls for items.

[FlameStrike]

Uh yeah, and what about those unlucky with the dicebag?

 More seriously now, yes i agree that paladins/clerics/champions should donate often, but if they're poorly equipped, they won't have the means to help others...

 Not saying my paladin wouldn't donate, of course, but even paladins have, or at least should be different one from another.

[Leanthar]

@FlameStrike, Regardles...Paladins take that oath and if one is a true Paladin well it would be tithed--if properly RP'd.

[FlameStrike]

7. Make no demands of others. A knight of Toran should be proud and self sufficient. There is no shame in accepting offers of help, but a Paladin in Toran's service should never reduce himself to beggary or desperate pleas.

 There is no oath that requires or even obliges a Toranite paladin to donate, of course there's no need for one to exist as it is obviously understood that a paladin will donate a share of his findings to his/her church.
Just pointing out that, but 90 or even 95% is a huge share and i do think that if a paladin with brains knows he'll be unable to help if he/she can't afford to get at least decent equipment because of donating too much, then he'll/she'll reduce the donations a bit.

 And yeah, my paladin donates although not often, as that's directly proportional to the playtime i have, unfortunately

[Talan Va'lash]

well, it would be like 95%, but if we were in the ideal "realistic" PnPish situation the church would provide almost all of the paladins needs. Housing, food when the paladin is in a temple, even armor and equiptment. Its like, the paladin would give all his monies to the church, which would then spend it appropriately with all the other money it has from other sources and then the church would equip its clerics and paladins.

This isn't really the buisiness model we see in a PW because well, no one wants to spend their time being the toranite quartermaster. Plus it takes *some* of the fun out of equiping yourself if you play a divine character.

So while those large percentages are proper in the traditional fantasy genre they aren't really appropriate considering that we aren't taking the donation money and doing with it, what the church would do in a traditional fantasy genre (and I'm pretty sure we're not going to do that as it would be a bunch of work and not really add to anyone's enjoyment.)

Disclaimer: IMHO

[Pen N Popper]

Would it be acceptable to count temple donations against coins spent on gear?

[jjkolb]

FYI, this is taken from AD&D 2.0 Rules Supplement -- "The Complete Paladin's Handbook" (admittedly old)
"Tithing   A paladin must give 10% of all his income to a lawful good institution. This 10% is called a tithe. In most cases, a paladin tithes to his church or other religious organization. If he doesn't belong to a church or operates independently (as in the case of the Expatriate character kit described in Chapter 4), he may designate any lawful good organization, such as a hospital or university, as the recipient of his tithes. A paladin has no say in how his tithes are spent, though the money typically goes towards the institution's maintenance, recruitment, equipment, and education costs. A paladin usually tithes to the same institution for his entire career. A paladin's first tithe usually comes out of his starting funds of 5d4 x 10 gp. After that, he must tithe from all sources of income, including rewards, treasure, wages, and profits generated from his stronghold. When he acquires a gem or magical item, he owes his designated institution 10% of the item's value (as determined by the DM), payable at the earliest opportunity. If he finds a diamond worth 500 gp, he owes 50 gp; if the gem is lost or stolen, he still owes 50 gp (the institution isn't penalized for the paladin's carelessness). Tithes are due only on funds the paladin actually claims for himself. If he walks away from a treasure or refuses a reward, no tithes are necessary. It's the paladin's responsibility to get his tithes to his institution as soon as possible. A monthly payment will suffice in most cases, with the paladin turning in 10% of all the income he's acquired in the previous four weeks. If a monthly payment is impossible or impractical—for instance, if the paladin is on a mission halfway around the world, or if he's a prisoner of war—he may make other arrangements, providing he offers a satisfactory explanation. A paladin may personally present his tithings to his institution or he may deliver them by messenger.
  Tithes carried by the paladin but not yet delivered are still considered to be the property of the institution. A starving paladin who has no other funds aside from 10 gp of tithes may not spend his tithes on food, unless he first petitions his deity for permission. If he's behaved responsibly—say, if he used his last gold piece to pay for treatment of a dying child—permission is usually granted, with the understanding that the tithes must be replaced."
 Now, while I think 10% is much too low, I also feel that 90-95% is too high. A paladin's armor and weaponry cost money and Klaug is neither an armorsmith or weaponsmith. For a non-crafter, true is hard to come by.
  On the other hand, tithes do not have to be in the form of money. A good deal of Klaug's donations come in the form of items.

[Leanthar]

@jkolb, thanks for posting that and I do agree with you that 90% is too high.  It doesn't really matter if one crafts or not though, the "tithe" would be any sort of item gained (in whatever way)--or more precisely the value of that item. Since it is an online game and not PnP it is very difficult to track. I know most only players do not tithe 1% even though they should and other tithe a lot which is good RP. Sort of a gray line that we would never be able to control in any way, even through coded systems probably.  So again, we ask for good judgement and common sense from players.

[Shadowblade225]

Well I think regarding tithing, some things are just common sense.  In which case I now realize that unless I mention it, it goes under the term "yes, but..." and a handful of other players will happily strive to point out the exceptions.  If your character's sword, sheild or whatever is grossly outdated, there is nothing wrong with saving up for certain items.  There is unquestionably little doubt that eventually someone will put out an item in the trade and market hall that is in all respects better than what your character currently uses.  In which case saving gold so that you will be able to buy such an item is certainly a wise idea as of course, the temple isn't going to provide you with such things.  But when I see a paladin getting rich in various ways, with little contribution to their temple I suppose anything about tithing is worth mentioning.   Whatever else I can say is just reverberating what has already been stated.  Use common sense, maximize what you can within the realm of NWN game mechanics and the essential needs of your PC, etc..  

And for the record...I (and many others) would kill to have Syn's dicebag

[egoober]

I have to agree with Shadowblade here, look at the concept of the Paladin (or even Cleric) and apply common sense. In my case, that has meant tithing relatively little at lower levels, but spending a huge amount on potions to heal other people. These days my character makes most of the potions he needs, so donations have gone up. If he needs a new piece of kit he saves for it (which can take a long time, given his dislike of bloodshed), and reduces donations to allow him to do so.
If he's not saving; then almost all his gold, after day to day expenses, goes in donations. Oh, and if he finds an item that he doesn't have a use for, the odds are it will be donated rather than sold.
Ok so he's broke most of the time, and usually misses out on those auctioned items that he'd like due to a lack of ready cash. Having said that, he gets some neat things in return: He gets to be immune to fear and disease, can cure massive wounds with a touch, his god strengthens his arm, and shields him from harm. All of which have to be worth a fair few gold, IMHO!