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Author Topic: Opening up of Unholy Champions of Corath, Pyrtechon and Baraeon Ca'Duz  (Read 699 times)

EdTheKet

Due to a recent request in the Corath forums, we re-discussed the opening up of the Unholy Champion PrC for player characters.

The Unholy Champions of Corath and Pyrtechon have an alignment requirement of CE, making them effectively unavailable for players.
This requirements is not coded.

Therefore, we decided that the Unholy Champion of Corath PrC and the Unholy Champin of Pyrtechon PrC can also be taken by characters of NE alignment (who meet all the other prerequisites of course).

In addition, followers of Baraeon Ca'Duz will also be allowed to take the Unholy Champion of Corath PrC, this because Baraeon followers use the short sword, just like Corathites do. We will not create a separate PrC package for these Baraeon Ca'duz champions, but while they take the Unholy Champion of Corath PrC they would be Unholy Champions of Baraeon Ca'duz.


- Taking these PrCs requires the same difficulty/character submission approval process as the Champion PrC (i.e. one or more CDQs).
- There can be more than one per deity (just like for Champions)
- If your char hasn't got the NE alignment yet, you would first need a CDQ to reach NE before you can go down the road to the Unholy Champion CDQ(s)

If there are any other questions, please post here.
 

Script Wrecked

Re: Opening up of Unholy Champions of Corath, Pyrtechon and Bara
« Reply #1 on: January 04, 2010, 10:29:45 am »
[INDENT]"By the pricking of my thumbs..."[/INDENT]
 

EdTheKet

Re: Opening up of Unholy Champions of Corath, Pyrtechon and Bara
« Reply #2 on: January 04, 2010, 10:30:58 am »
Quote from: Script Wrecked
[INDENT]"By the pricking of my thumbs..."[/INDENT]

I don't get it?
 

Script Wrecked

Re: Opening up of Unholy Champions of Corath, Pyrtechon and Bara
« Reply #3 on: January 04, 2010, 10:57:35 am »
My apologies.

[INDENT]"By the pricking of my thumbs, something wicked this way comes."[/INDENT]

is said by the second witch to announce the impending arrival of the now fallen (and soon to commit further atrocities) Macbeth.
 

EdTheKet

Re: Opening up of Unholy Champions of Corath, Pyrtechon and Bara
« Reply #4 on: January 04, 2010, 11:04:43 am »
Lol, now I do, and I know that quote too.

I thought your post got cut off so I didn't even think further!

The devil hath power
To assume a pleasing shape.

Hamlet, act 2, scene 2

(So an unholy champion doesn't have to look all nasty, pock-faced, one-eyed, dressed in black, standard-evil-garment like )
 

Ravemore

Re: Opening up of Unholy Champions of Corath, Pyrtechon and Bara
« Reply #5 on: January 04, 2010, 12:33:08 pm »
LOL... I bet I can name at least four people that are either scribbling away at new character concepts, or mapping out CDQ's on current ones. ;-)
 

Spike

Re: Opening up of Unholy Champions of Corath, Pyrtechon and Bara
« Reply #6 on: January 05, 2010, 08:35:35 am »
Quote from: Ravemore
LOL... I bet I can name at least four people that are either scribbling away at new character concepts, or mapping out CDQ's on current ones. ;-)


Guilty!
 

Polak76

Re: Opening up of Unholy Champions of Corath, Pyrtechon and Bara
« Reply #7 on: January 06, 2010, 04:01:53 am »
Yes, you'll probably see a cleric submission shortly from me, although I'm toying with a few other mixes.

Cheers,
Polak
 

akata

Re: Opening up of Unholy Champions of Corath, Pyrtechon and Bara
« Reply #8 on: January 06, 2010, 02:08:46 pm »
Since unholy champions are pretty much the embodiment of evil and the fact that there is a whole lot of high lvl good characters running around,
then I'm curious to how the team expect this to work on a non-PvP server?
Yes we all have PvP widget, but you still need approval from your target. With fewer dm's around to manage "forced" PvP then I'm foreseeing a whole lot of hiding behind the PvP widget
 

Spike

Re: Opening up of Unholy Champions of Corath, Pyrtechon and Bara
« Reply #9 on: January 06, 2010, 02:22:21 pm »
Quote from: akata
Since unholy champions are pretty much the embodiment of evil and the fact that there is a whole lot of high lvl good characters running around,
then I'm curious to how the team expect this to work on a non-PvP server?
Yes we all have PvP widget, but you still need approval from your target. With fewer dm's around to manage "forced" PvP then I'm foreseeing a whole lot of hiding being the PvP widget


To be honest I don't see this to be a problem. I would guess that those planning to play unholy champions wouldn't ponce around in black spiky armour of death challenging every other character they came across to a fight and then running up to the nearest temple of Toran to set it on fire (with the exception of Pyrtechon of course :rolleyes: ). Both Corath and Baraeon Ca'Duz rely on deceit, so characters announcing for all to hear that they are unholy champions kinda defeats the point. That said there may of course be times when pvp is needed, but no more than a normal evil deity following cleric would expect. Yes they are champions of evil, but evil isn't just about charging at the good guys, sword flailing ;) .
 

akata

Re: Opening up of Unholy Champions of Corath, Pyrtechon and Bara
« Reply #10 on: January 06, 2010, 03:20:30 pm »
Quote from: Spike
To be honest I don't see this to be a problem. I would guess that those planning to play unholy champions wouldn't ponce around in black spiky armour of death challenging every other character they came across to a fight and then running up to the nearest temple of Toran to set it on fire (with the exception of Pyrtechon of course :rolleyes: ). Both Corath and Baraeon Ca'Duz rely on deceit, so characters announcing for all to hear that they are unholy champions kinda defeats the point. That said there may of course be times when pvp is needed, but no more than a normal evil deity following cleric would expect. Yes they are champions of evil, but evil isn't just about charging at the good guys, sword flailing ;) .


A champion is in no way the same as your normal evil deity following cleric, they are more devoted in their worship, hence why they need(ed) to be the exact same alignment as the deity. With that level of dedication to their gods then in a small world like Layonara it will only be a matter of time before they're found out. What then?

The same as happens with the dark elfs?

It will become so common that people won't even notice or care anymore?

Sorry but in my opinion then the ultimate evil that champions are should be left for npc's, the NwN simply lacks the skills it requires to rp deceit on that level. It is going to take up a lot of dm time or its going to be the same as with evil characters now. Mostly ignored because the engine can't handle things like disguise and sense motive
 

Ravemore

Re: Opening up of Unholy Champions of Corath, Pyrtechon and Bara
« Reply #11 on: January 06, 2010, 04:01:34 pm »
Quote from: akata
A champion is in no way the same as your normal evil deity following cleric, they are more devoted in their worship, hence why they need(ed) to be the exact same alignment as the deity. With that level of dedication to their gods then in a small world like Layonara it will only be a matter of time before they're found out. What then?

The same as happens with the dark elfs?

It will become so common that people won't even notice or care anymore?

Sorry but in my opinion then the ultimate evil that champions are should be left for npc's, the NwN simply lacks the skills it requires to rp deceit on that level. It is going to take up a lot of dm time or its going to be the same as with evil characters now. Mostly ignored because the engine can't handle things like disguise and sense motive


I disagree 100% with this position. The blanket statement that they are in no way the same as your normal evil deity following cleric is a red herring. They are merely a different tool for the god's use and a different path for the character. To say that a Champion is more favored then a high level cleric can be debated back and forth, so there really is no point. If the ultimate evil should be left only for NPC's then it could be argued that the ultimate good should as well. This will work perfectly, and the reason for this is the alignment change. NE are not reckless evil killing machines wearing black spike armor and burning down the churches as Spike mentioned. If they were, they would be hunted out and killed. They are sneaky, insidious, and scheming, and work to bring about ruin and the greater vision of their god. They are not pressured to preach, convert, or make their actions in any way public, although they may... and if too open about it likely to be killed by an a mob of Toranites.

The world is not that small, and we as a community have done a stellar job in maintaining the flavor and enjoyment of Layonara , even after pvp became an allowable activity under the right circumstances.

If they are found out, I am sure it will be role-played appropriately... banishment, prison, deaths, all are possibilities and have great potential to enhance the role-play experience. Evil characters are not ignored now. We do much behind the scenes, and the fact that this is not public knowledge does nothing but support my position. Akata, give it a chance with an open mind. I don't think you will be disappointed in the long run. :)
 

Spike

Re: Opening up of Unholy Champions of Corath, Pyrtechon and Bara
« Reply #12 on: February 08, 2010, 09:47:20 am »
Hey,

I just have a question about the RP aspect of the Class.

How exactly does the church (and corathites in general) view unholy champions? Are they like lesser versions of 'The' Unholy Champion (independent entities within the Os Inasnum) or do they need to be associated with one of church factions in order to be recognised?
 

EdTheKet

Re: Opening up of Unholy Champions of Corath, Pyrtechon and Bara
« Reply #13 on: February 08, 2010, 10:47:37 am »
Quote from: Spike
Hey,

I just have a question about the RP aspect of the Class.

How exactly does the church (and corathites in general) view unholy champions? Are they like lesser versions of 'The' Unholy Champion (independent entities within the Os Inasnum) or do they need to be associated with one of church factions in order to be recognised?
They wouldn't be independent entities within the church.
You can find most of them as members of Sanctum, Morsus or Furax. They wouldn't refer themselves as Unholy Champions either, by the way but as member of one of the factions.
You can also find them as members of The Ravens.

They are not lesser versions of the Inanus Viscus, as this person is directly chosen by Corath himself.

Hope that helps :)
 

Spike

Re: Opening up of Unholy Champions of Corath, Pyrtechon and Bara
« Reply #14 on: February 08, 2010, 11:19:48 am »
Quote from: EdTheKet
They wouldn't be independent entities within the church.
You can find most of them as members of Sanctum, Morsus or Furax. They wouldn't refer themselves as Unholy Champions either, by the way but as member of one of the factions.
You can also find them as members of The Ravens.

They are not lesser versions of the Inanus Viscus, as this person is directly chosen by Corath himself.

Hope that helps :)


So does that mean a character wouldnt be recognised as one? As in there would be no RP benifit to being one. Also does Corath have any hand in deciding who becomes one (sort of like a 'calling')? (Im just trying to figure out how to advance the plot in my cdt).
 

EdTheKet

Re: Opening up of Unholy Champions of Corath, Pyrtechon and Bara
« Reply #15 on: February 08, 2010, 01:37:20 pm »
Quote from: Spike
So does that mean a character wouldnt be recognised as one?

Correct, if you mean any things that would affect appearance that would identify somebody as unholy champ. So no birthmarks, tattoos, divine marks, albino hair, skeletal hands, rotten limbs, missing eyes or whatnot :)

Just like you wouldn't be able to say from appearance that somebody is a Champion of Toran, or Vorax.

Quote
As in there would be no RP benifit to being one.
Having this PrC does not automatically give you extra status or clout within the church, no. Just like "just" having a champion of Vorax, or Toran PrC doesn't automatically give you status in those churches.

Quote
Also does Corath have any hand in deciding who becomes one (sort of like a 'calling')? (Im just trying to figure out how to advance the plot in my cdt).
No, he does not, just like Toran or Vorax have no hand in deciding who becomes a Champion of them.

As you can see, I'm trying to be consistent amongst the Champion PrCs and the Unholy Champion PrCs.
 

EdTheKet

Re: Opening up of Unholy Champions of Corath, Pyrtechon and Bara
« Reply #16 on: April 26, 2010, 01:38:44 pm »
They now have separate pages on LORE, access them through LORE: Champions