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Author Topic: Urgent information about Layonara on NWN  (Read 2769 times)

Dorganath

Urgent information about Layonara on NWN
« on: December 03, 2013, 10:08:24 pm »

Dear Layonara Community,

Over the years, NWN-based Layonara has undergone several evolutions and benefited from various sorts of contributions from our community. Among these in particular are the financial considerations of hosting this game world and the way in which they have impacted the make-up of the game world. One rather profound transformation lies in the collection of servers we have running the world. When I started, we had seven physical servers: four running individual modules, one running the database, one running the forums and one spare that eventually became used as the quest server. At the time we also had a pretty sweet deal for hosting them at a pretty major data center. That situation changed, however, and hosting costs shot through the roof and to a point where it was unrealistic for us to continue on with that configuration, so we had to make changes. Fast-forward to today, we have only two servers: one running the actual game across two modules and one for the forums.

Over the years we have asked for and welcomed donations to help with the server costs. We cannot require people to pay to play here, as it would violate the terms of the EULA for NWN. We also cannot offer in-game incentives and other game-related monetizations for the same reasons. For the most part, this has been acceptable for us, because running Layonara on NWN has never been about making money.

We have, unfortunately, hit something of a crucial financial point that requires attention. The two servers we have cost us an average of $268 CAD each month (NOTE: this is about the same in USD given current exchange rates). To break that down a little, the game server costs about $118/month and the forums server costs about $150/month. This cost is presently split by three of us, and but there has been a change for one who can no longer continue to contribute his share as he has been. This was hinted about in a recent devlog entry. In essence, we are in a situation where we either need to start bringing in regular donations from the community to make up for our shortfall or make some hard choices about the fate of Layonara on NWN. So in this context, we essentially have one question for this community:

Do you want to see NWN Layonara continue?

Our web site will remain; that is a cost we can and will continue to shoulder. Layonara as a whole is not going anywhere, and in fact, we have more than a few plans being set into motion. Whether or not the NWN game server will continue, however, will depend on the community's interest and the community's ability to donate regularly and sufficiently to keep the servers running. To be clear, we are not asking for a lot from individuals. If each member of our active player base could chip in even $5 or $10 USD each month, it would make a significant difference and allow us to continue on with relative ease.

Starting very soon, we're going to start holding some regular donation drives, though we would also welcome anyone who wants to regularly donate to the server fund. Clearly, we would welcome and encourage both. Any overages would, of course, be applied to future fees.

Ideally, community contributions and donations would fully fund the NWN server (approx. $118/month). If we could even get $100/month from community donations, it would eliminate the short-fall that will occur. This sounds like a lot for a single person, but when divided several ways, it's really not that much.

To potentially help with your decision, before this financial news came to light, we have been working on several initiatives for the game world. The Fortune system is the first of them, but also we have GMs planning some new efforts and collaborations. Leanthar and EdTheKet are working on putting together some new and (hopefully) exciting things. We have several things in motion right now, but if there is insufficient interest in the community for such things...or if there is just an insufficient ability or desire for you all as a group to contribute a small amount each month to keep the servers running...then there is little justification to continue on with NWN.

At the risk of sounding gloomy or dramatic, the sad truth is that the NWN server's fate will likely be decided by the end of the year if we do not gain enough in the way of donations before then. There's really no way to sugar-coat this, so I won't try. It's no longer a request; we cannot continue to support both servers without the assistance of the community.

So the choice is truly in your hands. We wish we didn't have to reduce this down to a matter of money, but unfortunately wishes won't keep the lights on, as the saying goes.

As this has all come to light somewhat recently, we do not yet have a resource set up to handle donations (please do not use the old links; these may be changing), but we anticipate having something very soon. We're just trying to figure out which of several possibilities will work out the best in terms of fees and overhead. For now, feel free to discuss and ask questions about this. We'll answer what we can.

-- Dorganath (on behalf of the entire Layonara team)

 
The following users thanked this post: lonnarin, miltonyorkcastle, Lance Stargazer, Alatriel, Aphel

Charm2009

I be willing to throw $5-10
« Reply #1 on: December 03, 2013, 11:25:50 pm »

I be willing to throw $5-10 in the pot each month.

 

Dorax Windsmith

I can pledge at least $10 per
« Reply #2 on: December 03, 2013, 11:50:11 pm »

I can pledge at least $10 per month.  I'd very much like to see the NWN server continue until there is another playing option available.

 

Guardian 452

Mr. Mom is going back to the
« Reply #3 on: December 04, 2013, 12:36:01 am »

Mr. Mom is going back to the working world this up comming Monday. I'll help out if I can. And since we aren't sugar coating things ....

 

Steps should be taken to contact old players.

Let them know of Layos recent changes.... Changes to come. And the situation the nwn servers are in now. And I don't mean Facebook & twitter... Try to actually contact folks via email.

Find out why they left.

What would bring them back?

Consider addressing some of the reasons people left.

 

NWN Layo doesn't have a future with new people.... It's current & former player base is it's only hope to make it until Layos next platform.

 

 

belteshazzar

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    I will put in $10/mo.
    « Reply #4 on: December 04, 2013, 12:47:54 am »

    I will put in $10/mo.

     

    Aphel

    I agree with G-452, but want
    « Reply #5 on: December 04, 2013, 05:10:42 am »

    I agree with G-452, but want to add a point to his argument:

    Quote from: "Guardian 452"&cid="2752199"

    Consider addressing some of the reasons people left.

    Or why they  are leaving. It's not coming out of the blue, most of the time.

     

    gilshem ironstone

    Dorg-How much of a financial
    « Reply #6 on: December 04, 2013, 07:43:15 am »

    Dorg-How much of a financial commitment do you need by Years End?  The entire $1416?  Or enough to carry through a few months?  

    I will commit $10/month for sure, and hopefully some in donation drives. 

     

    cbnicholson

    I say have a few send off x2
    « Reply #7 on: December 04, 2013, 08:50:07 am »

    I say have a few send off x2 xp weekends and shut it down.  As someone who has been a long time donator, my opinion is that Layo is about done. Another round of donations is only going to delay the inevitable even if they amount to enough to keep it Layo running for the next few months.  I don't believe anyone has a particular onus against the team or the state of things ig, I just think many of us, myself included, have outgrown the world and possibly the system it runs on.   The changes like fortune have been nice, but from my perspective they haven't enticed me to play more nor do they seem to be having the desired effect on the vast majority of former/present players.    My 2 true.


     

    "Give a man a mask and he will show you his true face." 

    Oscar Wilde
     

    Dorganath

    gilshem ironstone
    « Reply #8 on: December 04, 2013, 08:56:12 am »

    Quote from: "gilshem ironstone"&cid="2752203"

    Dorg-How much of a financial commitment do you need by Years End?  The entire $1416?  Or enough to carry through a few months?  

    I will commit $10/month for sure, and hopefully some in donation drives. 

    We don't need to have the entire year's funds (or even a pledge for such) by the end of the year, though we will not complain at all if that works out. At a minimum, we need enough to get us through January. Having a few months worth of cushion would be nice.  Consider this our first donation drive...in a long time, anyway. Expect more in the future, assuming we continue.

    In truth, what we need to know soon is whether or not this community has both the interest and ability to play a significant role in the financial support of the NWN server. If the interest and support is there, we'll keep going. I know it's short-notice on this rather immediate need, but life is like that sometimes.

     

    miltonyorkcastle

    I can surely handle at least
    « Reply #9 on: December 04, 2013, 09:35:03 am »

    I can surely handle at least $5 a month.

     

    Dorganath

    Guardian 452 wrote:Steps
    « Reply #10 on: December 04, 2013, 09:37:20 am »

    Quote from: "Guardian 452"&cid="2752199"

    Steps should be taken to contact old players.

    Let them know of Layos recent changes.... Changes to come. And the situation the nwn servers are in now. And I don't mean Facebook & twitter... Try to actually contact folks via email.

    Find out why they left.

    What would bring them back?

    Consider addressing some of the reasons people left.

    These are good thoughts, and certainly something to consider as a longer-term effort, but the impact of such would likely take months to realize.  The purpose of this thread is to address an immediate need and to determine what our current community is willing to do.

    I know it's within the realm of possibility for our current community to float the shortfall, at least in the short term.  Last month, we had 71 individual player accounts in-game at one point or the other. Even allowing for the fact that some of these are alternates for the same player, that still leaves around 60 people who could possibly contribute. If each of these contributed a modest amount on a monthly basis, both servers would be paid for with some small amount left-over. If even a fraction of those players gave a slightly larger amount each month, we could easily pay for the NWN server. This is the most immediate thing that needs to be determined and soon. If the servers are going to continue, then we can look at addressing the reasons for old players not playing here anymore.

    ----

    This topic is probably one for a different thread, but I do happen to know that some of the reasons are things beyond our control.  Some people have left due to interpersonal conflicts with and/or predatory actions by long-time and/or "influential" members of the community, finding this option easier than bringing forth these issues.  Some have left due to changes in their personal situations. I know there are people who have left because they no longer have time or have had technical/financial issues that are not easily resolved.

    I also know some people disagree with things we do here which are non-negotiable (such as our family-friendly requirements). I know some people have found greener pastures in other, glitzier games. I know some of the fault is on us for a reduced level of GM activity (which we have been addressing). I also know there are other reasons, so do not think I am deflecting this off and calling it "out of my hands".

    I also know that when asked these sorts of questions, people aren't always as honest with the "powers that be" as they are with other players.  The "real" reasons people leave are often not mentioned, even when we ask them directly. Beyond that, what "we" say to try to encourage them back doesn't usually have as much impact as the word of mouth from their fellow players. 

    So if you (any of you) know people who are not playing here any longer, consider reaching out to them.

    ----

    Quote

    NWN Layo doesn't have a future with new people.... It's current & former player base is it's only hope to make it until Layos next platform.

    What Layonara needs for the long term, in general, is eyeballs and evangelists.  A small, dedicated community can keep NWN going indefinitely, but the long-term success of the world depends on much more than the NWN player base.

     

    gilshem ironstone

    I also think the onus for
    « Reply #11 on: December 04, 2013, 09:53:34 am »

    I also think the onus for contacting former players should not be on the Team alone, but on all the players that had contact with them over the years.  We, as players have a different perspective on how Layo has changed and should take it upon ourselves to capitalize on that.

     

    Nyralotep

    Where is the donate button?
    « Reply #12 on: December 04, 2013, 10:11:54 am »

    Where is the donate button?

     

    Aphel

    Nyralotep wrote:Where is the
    « Reply #13 on: December 04, 2013, 10:17:32 am »

    Quote from: "Nyralotep"&cid="2752209"

    Where is the donate button?

    I am sure a squad of specially trained squirrel-monkeys will be dispatched to deal with that issue shortly.

     

    Serissa

    Rick and I would be happy to
    « Reply #14 on: December 04, 2013, 10:21:54 am »

    Rick and I would be happy to go back to donating $20/month, just need a way to do it.

     

    Dorganath

    Aphel wrote:Nyralotep
    « Reply #15 on: December 04, 2013, 10:29:25 am »

    Quote from: "Aphel"&cid="2752210"

    Quote from: "Nyralotep"&cid="2752209"

    Where is the donate button?

    I am sure a squad of specially trained squirrel-monkeys will be dispatched to deal with that issue shortly.

    Correct!

     

    Dorganath

    And the trained
    « Reply #16 on: December 04, 2013, 11:33:41 am »

    And the trained squirrel-monkeys have produced:

    http://layonara.com/donate

    Thanks to everyone for their interest and comments so far.

     

    Dorganath

    Wow!If you all haven't seen,
    « Reply #17 on: December 04, 2013, 10:41:56 pm »

    Wow!

    If you all haven't seen, we've already reached our goal for December, which is awesome!  Thanks to all who have donated!

    If you haven't yet donated but are still willing to do so, please donate. Overages will go toward the server fees for subsequent months.

     

    lonnarin

    *Tosses $50 in the
    « Reply #18 on: December 05, 2013, 03:10:41 am »

    *Tosses $50 in the hat*

    Missing a lot of play/GM time due to my hectic work schedule recently, so I might as well put all that overtime to good use!  Game On.

     

    Tobias

    I have not been in on in a
    « Reply #19 on: December 06, 2013, 08:39:52 pm »

    I have not been in on in a long time due to personal reasons but, I do not want to see NWN Layonara end.  I have been on and off for almost 10 years (wow!) and it might be hard for me to find time to play but,  the team and the community are always in my thoughts.  I have just donated $20 to help keep NWN Layonara alive until we can see what the next generation has in store for us! 

     I will commit to at leat $5 a month going forward. The Team and Community are what keep me coming back for almost ten years and it's high time that I say thank you with more than words. 

     

    Miss all you guys and hope everyone is doing well! Can't wait to see what 2014 brings to Layonara! 

    Hopefully see you all in game,

    Brandon