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Author Topic: Clarifying note on regeneration  (Read 2644 times)

EdTheKet

Clarifying note on regeneration
« on: January 16, 2009, 02:32:55 am »
Minerva raised a good point recently, and after talking to Leanthar, we've come up with some more, and came up with the following rules of thumb for everyone out there on how regeneration works on Layonara.

- f you lost a limb/body part, and you still have the wound, it regenerates if you have regeneration cast on you. You do not have to have the lost limb/body part in order for it to grow back.

 - A lost limb/body part cannot regenerate if the wound has healed normally (bandage or time), or by magic means (like a Cure Minor Wounds).

 (i.e. if somebody lost a leg last year, and a regeneration spell is cast a year later, the leg doesn't grow back, or Chanda who lost her finger years ago, will not get it back if she now has regeneration cast on her)

 - if you are raised or resurrected, you return to full health, all limbs/body parts attached.
 
 -if you are a person that already misses a limb/body part, and that limb/body part loss was healed by normal or magic means in the past, and you get raised/resurrected, you do not come back with that limb/body part.

- if you lose a limb/body part because of a disease, this is not cured by regeneration or after raising/resurrecting
 
- if you lose a limb/body part because of a curse, this is not cured by regeneration or after raising/resurrecting.

- lost limbs/body parts can only be restored/returned by major NPC (GM controlled), ritualistic healing magic involving several clerics (under GM supervision), CDQ or artefact under GM control. (We don't want players able to negate silly and stupid decisions or actions by simply casting a spell like regeneration.). Loss of a limb or body part is done by RP, so the return of a limb/body part will also involve RP.

- dismemberment/mutilation/torture is to be available to Evil PCs (within reason, and all players involved consenting OOCly). It cannot be forced on a player character without this consent, this is griefing and not allowed (regardless of the fact that it would indeed be possible, it is griefing, so do not do it)

Other points:
- Regeneration on an item is considered the same as regeneration from the spell.
- Vampiric regeneration is considered the same as regeneration from the spell, except it goes in bursts as this heals you for the damage you deal.
- Cure XXX Wounds and the Heal spell, or healing potions, do not discriminate between wounds. When used, as much damage as the spell/potion can heal is healed.

If there's any questions, please post them here.
 

Pibemanden

Re: Clarifying note on regeneration
« Reply #1 on: January 16, 2009, 02:49:28 am »
What if you are regenerating as part of some item? Is that considered as magical regeneration or just minor healing?
 

Weeblie

Re: Clarifying note on regeneration
« Reply #2 on: January 16, 2009, 03:34:52 am »
What about Greater Restoration?
 

Dorganath

Re: Clarifying note on regeneration
« Reply #3 on: January 16, 2009, 08:33:00 am »
Greater Restoration does not do anything for lost limbs.  It heals, removes effects of diseases, level drain, etc.
 

Script Wrecked

Re: Clarifying note on regeneration
« Reply #4 on: January 16, 2009, 09:48:10 am »
Quote from: EdTheKet
- A lost limb/body part cannot regenerate if the wound has healed normally (bandage or time)...


Is by time, mechanically, resting?

Quote from: EdTheKet
... or by magic means (like a Cure Minor Wounds).


Does the Cure Wounds/Heal spell or Cure Wounds/Heal potion or the healing kit (viz, the Heal skill) have to be "directed" explicitly to the wound site to affect the healing of it, or does having Cure Wounds/Heal cast upon you or drinking a Cure Wounds/Heal potion or applying the healing kit affect all wounds generally, and thus affect the wound of the missing limb/body part?

Regards,

Script Wrecked.
 

Chongo

Re: Clarifying note on regeneration
« Reply #5 on: January 16, 2009, 09:54:37 am »
Quote from: Pibemanden
What if you are regenerating as part of some item? Is that considered as magical regeneration or just minor healing?

Question seconded.

And do you want to clarify vampiric regeneration on an item while we're at it?
 

Weeblie

Re: Clarifying note on regeneration
« Reply #6 on: January 16, 2009, 10:03:02 am »
The current description sounds a little bit harsh, as it seems to be more or less impossible to get one's limbs back. It's highly likely that you would lose a limb or two if you were to receive critical amounts of damage in combat (happens a little now and then), and in that case, it's also highly likely someone would cast heal or greater restoration on you (not any of the regeneration spells). Since none of the spells (not even ressurection) can give you your limbs back once a removal and healing cycle has been performed, it looks like most adventurers should be walking around without some body parts. ;)

Or is the "restoration won't work" part only (truly) appliable if you are using a restoration spell "too late"? Too late refering in this case to the "last year" example.
 

Leanthar

Re: Clarifying note on regeneration
« Reply #7 on: January 16, 2009, 10:11:44 am »
I do not want, nor have I ever wanted, an "I win" button. Period. Regen, if not controlled is exactly that. Many DnD spells and combat skills are just that.
 
 As it is described above is how it was played in my PnP games and Layonara is based off of those games.
 
 Now, with that said. We will of course take things in to consideration and be fair where it applies.
 
 But if an adventurer gets a limb cut off then guess what...they SHOULD retire, at least in my books. *shrugs*
 

DMOE

Re: Clarifying note on regeneration
« Reply #8 on: January 16, 2009, 10:29:13 am »
Oh I remember that!

I remember and I'm sure those who played with her will also making the Fort checks when she got damaged to a certain level or when common sense dictated she had overly exerted herself ....

Imagine how much fun it is when your party cleric suddenly STOPS casting and fighting cause one arm and one leg has effectively 'gone to sleep'

I lost track of how many parties that nearly killed!!!!

But then....when Toranites started ranting about sacrifice for the greater good....It tended to shut them up so not without it's benefits ;)

I also remember her being unplayable for a week RL time while the limbs grew back, painfully I might add.
 

miltonyorkcastle

Re: Clarifying note on regeneration
« Reply #9 on: January 16, 2009, 10:40:49 am »
Quote
it looks like most adventurers should be walking around without some body parts.


Actually, that seems normal to me. Folks that enter combat as much as adventurers should be missing body-parts, or at least heavily scarred, unless they're wizards that never get into frontline combat.

Quote
But if an adventurer gets a limb cut off then guess what...they SHOULD retire, at least in my books. *shrugs*


But I love playing the one-armed, one-eyed, one-legged pirate! ;)
 

Hellblazer

Re: Clarifying note on regeneration
« Reply #10 on: January 16, 2009, 11:00:18 am »
All of that means is.. best have a few friends in the druidic community or a good cleric! ;)

Drizzlin

Re: Clarifying note on regeneration
« Reply #11 on: January 16, 2009, 12:47:10 pm »
Quote from: Weeblie
The current description sounds a little bit harsh, as it seems to be more or less impossible to get one's limbs back. It's highly likely that you would lose a limb or two if you were to receive critical amounts of damage in combat (happens a little now and then), and in that case, it's also highly likely someone would cast heal or greater restoration on you (not any of the regeneration spells). Since none of the spells (not even ressurection) can give you your limbs back once a removal and healing cycle has been performed, it looks like most adventurers should be walking around without some body parts. ;)

Or is the "restoration won't work" part only (truly) appliable if you are using a restoration spell "too late"? Too late refering in this case to the "last year" example.


If I loose a limb, I'll just have my friends finish me off and then raise me! j/king =P
 

Pibemanden

Re: Clarifying note on regeneration
« Reply #12 on: January 16, 2009, 02:59:17 pm »
I have a further question after a bit of thought, is it possible to force heal someone? I know that it has been established a few times that you can't force raise, but what about magical healing?
 

Dorganath

Re: Clarifying note on regeneration
« Reply #13 on: January 16, 2009, 04:02:40 pm »
What do you mean by "force heal"?  Isn't casting a healing spell on a person sort of forcing them to heal?
 

Pibemanden

Re: Clarifying note on regeneration
« Reply #14 on: January 16, 2009, 04:08:28 pm »
I mean, can you heal someone magically against their will?
 

Hellblazer

Re: Clarifying note on regeneration
« Reply #15 on: January 16, 2009, 04:34:13 pm »
That is what is being done already if you think about it. A normal pc can not normaly counter spell a mage or healer, unless he has the ability to, and even then that pc has to be aware of it being done. So unless you are conscious and in the position of counter spelling, you are activily being force healed. Think of a person that is in combat when he is being healed. He might not be aware that he is being heal, so he can not be for or against the act. And since the spell has no limits as to if the person is willing to be hurt or healed (thinking of magic missiles here, unless you have protection up or are counter spelling, you will get hurt), he will get the spell casted on him and the appropriate effects.
 
 Some one that is dead doesn't have the ability to prevent someone from raising him all toghether. From what I know ( and I am in no way a final source here but this is observation I have seen) there is a way for very powerful people to prevent the bindstone from taking you back to it, but if you are dead, there is no way for you to stop someone from raising you (unless you respawn).
 
 So basically each time someone cast a healing spell, he is effectivaly force healing the other person. Only way to stop it would be to break the process.

Marswipp

Re: Clarifying note on regeneration
« Reply #16 on: January 16, 2009, 04:37:02 pm »
You mean to force reattachment via a healing spell?
Playing D&D 3.5e, D&D 5e, Pathfinder, and exploring Starfinder through a VTT
 

Gulnyr

Re: Clarifying note on regeneration
« Reply #17 on: January 16, 2009, 06:31:19 pm »
Quote from: Hellblazer
Some one that is dead doesn't have the ability to prevent someone from raising him all toghether.

Mechanically, that's true.  It has been stated several times, though, that no one has to come back to life if they don't want to.  Just like that, with a full stop rather than an "unless" or a "but" or an "except."  So, if anyone "force raised" a character who didn't want to come back, everyone would probably need to pretend it never worked (even though it would happen in-game because of the mechanics).

The question of "forced healing" seems to be a possible way to prevent people from regrowing limbs, depending how the rules above are read.  These rules specifically:
Quote
- A lost limb/body part cannot regenerate if the wound has healed normally (bandage or time), or by magic means (like a Cure Minor Wounds).

-if you are a person that already misses a limb/body part, and that limb/body part loss was healed by normal or magic means in the past, and you get raised/resurrected, you do not come back with that limb/body part.

So, from a certain reading, it may be possible to chop off someone's arm, then heal them with a potion, thus "locking" their condition according to the second rule in the quote - they had been healed "in the past," meaning a subsequent raising or casting of regeneration would not return the limb.  If that is the way it is meant to happen, "force healing" would then be a possible tactic to cripple enemies.  And, by that reading, your own healer friend may permanently cripple you trying to save your life.  That's some crazy friendly fire accident, heh.
 

Hellblazer

Re: Clarifying note on regeneration
« Reply #18 on: January 16, 2009, 06:45:12 pm »
Oh yes I totally understood that. I was simply refering that forced healing is already what is done in game.
 
 I always assumed that anyone being raised IG was by ''their will'' as you refer to it, because if the person didn't want to be raised, it would either be his final path and thus perming, or simply just a choice to prevent a loss of xp to the cleric, to be an ooc matter and dealt in tells or ooc party chat before the cleric casts the spell. In a realistic IC manner though, the char that still has strands left, would not be concient to be able to make that decision, thus he wouldn't be able to stop someone from raising him unless he had made that clear before even dying.
 
 But thanks for clarifying that point for me, so basically if a char decides to pass to the neverland, even the cleric wouldn't be able to bring his soul back. But then again, that is something conflicting with what I saw in game, where you have a Resurection period of time, where someone could be brought back to life..(this was brought up at one point in a quest i was on) I think there is even a math table on lore about it. Can't find it anymore but it was somthing alike the level of the cleric x something = the numbers of years maximum that someone could be brought back to life after his death.

Acacea

Re: Clarifying note on regeneration
« Reply #19 on: January 16, 2009, 07:22:28 pm »
That sounds like the D&D rule on how far back a cleric can raise. It didn't, to my knowledge, have anything to do with being willing or unwilling, but rather the difficulty of bringing back someone who had fallen a long time ago. When active here, it was not intended to be taken with the addition of "against their will," just ... hard to do.

In Layonara it is now three days, regardless of cleric level.