Asking a CA: Paladin question

[Xirion]

Hey there!
I want to clarify if the PC I am planning right now would have a chance to be approved. I have written about half of the story right now and have most of the other half in my head... but before I go on woth writing and developing the char in my mind I would like to know if it is wasted energy, so here is the point:

I want to create a Paladin of Toran. I read about the oath and vows, abou Toran in general and the char I am planning would follow that ofcourse.
BUT...
First I am planning to use a twohanded sword and no longsword
second I would like him to have the look a bit like a commoner... tan, beige or brown tones, a cape covering his fullplate, so that he wouldnot -look- like a paladin (ofcourse he would act as one)
and third (and last) he would not be trained by his uncle, a paladin of Toran (not active anylonger because he lost a leg and is old)

If it would help I would show you my writing so far
Thanks for reading
Greetings
Xirion

[DMOE]

Firstly....I'm not a DM so this isn't an 'offical' answer.....

I guess my question would be why would a paladin.....A man so dedicated to his god that he takes vows as serious as a paladin's vows not want to use his god's favored weapon or wear his god's colors?  

Remember....a paladin is granted divine powers by his god so to *me* you'd have to have a pretty good reason to justify this to your god but still showing your dedication because I feel that the whole point of favored weapons and colors is about visibly showing your dedication to your god.

I sort of got the impression that paladins train within the church to become paladins...to learn all the lore and history as well as battle training although I could be wrong there

[Xirion]

No I dont think your wrong... -usually- they learn it that way
The concern with the colours is that he had ordinary parents and wants to show his connection to the common people, his past (his parents are dead)
He would wear and Ankh in the clours of toran and an great ankh at his robe, so it is not that he would hide his belifes or something...

And he uses this sword because he found out while he was training with his uncle that he can handle it better than a sword sword.

ah and thanks for the answer

*waist for a CA*

[Leanthar]

We have allowed a few exceptions but they are pretty rare. Most of them were at the very beginning of when we were changing things for Paladins and things were not yet put in text for rules and such (at least to the level they are now).
 
 DMOE is right though. You would not be Paladin if your diety did not allow you to be, they give you the power and answer the prayers and there are no exceptions on that fact. Therefore since you represent the deity on a higher level than a cleric, and indeed one step removed from a Champion, they are quite strict and would not think it is okay to not represent them because you want to represent a commoner.
 
 From their point of view they would say the commoner does not give you the power, "I" give you the power, represent me and not them. This is most especially true on the colors. The weapon is a little different but they still feel strongly about that as well.

[minerva]

Actually DMOE is pretty much right on target.
 
 A paladin is more than a fighter with holy symbols on his shield and cloak. He or she is attempting to walk in the steps of their God. Toran would not want his paladin to be drably blending in, he want him to stand proud and stand out as a beacon in the crowd of his word and teachings.
 
 A paladin of Toran would be attempting to emulate the god they love, so the reason to deviate from his favor would have to be intense. Just saying "this suits me better" to me sounds like a thinly disguised 1d10 is better than 1d8.
 
 Paladins would be trained by the temple, but this is more loose as faith comes from many directions. Nothing to say the maimed uncle is not now retired and training from the auspices of a Toran facility.
 
 That said, a standard paladin would not be turned down for these reasons IF they were clearly written and woven to be INTEGRAL to the character concept. You would how ever have zero chance at Champion levels without using the favored weapon of your god.
 
 Edit : Too Slow  *points up*  What he said

[Weeblie]

This post is of course too slow also...

I think that neither of the reasons are strong enough to justify a skip from the usual "favored armor/weapon/color" guidelines.

The color-code should be held to an even greater standard than usual for such a well organised church like the Toran one. It's not only as a sign to show one's devotion to the faith, but also as a tool to show for the other non-followers that one is one of Toran's knights. Kind of a "candle in the dark"/"spreading hope" effect that would get nullified by using a color against the choice of the church (i.e. the weak peasants would not quickly be able to recognise him, from a distance, as a Toranite paladin of the good).

More chaotic or more shady deities and their respective churches would most probably have much more relaxed rules of this, I think.

When it comes to the weapon, the big question is: If he was trained by a Toranite, for the purpose of becomming a paladin of Toran, would he not have much more rigid training with longsword than other weapons, and hence by experience itself be more skilled with that weapon? It could be more understandable why he would prefer another weapon had he been a mercenary first and then redeemed/converted to a paladin, while still keeping the other weapon. But even in those cases, he would most likely have switched to the new favored weapon, as a token of showing utter devotion...

Paladins are tricky ones, as they are the epitome of faith to the deities. It's not a hobby-work... it's selling their own soul for the cause of their gods/goddesses!

[ycleption]

On the weapon, it's a funny thing... no one ever has a submission "I want to be a paladin, but the character's mother was an epic dart master, so my character will wield nothing but throwing darts." For some reason, it just happens to be greatswords or katana or the like...*shrug*

I think what everyone's saying is spot on, but that doesn't mean that the character concept is invalid, you may just have to compromise a bit.
Maybe, a shining, well polished symbol of Toran on his breastplate, but a tattered and well-used sturdy wool cloak.... show that he IS a paladin, and does not compromise on the symbols of his god, but contrast that with other details to show he is a man of the people.

[Xirion]

wow... I have not expected that much answers!
At first thanks for all, every answer hlped me abit... although I missed my favourite answer :"Hey thats no problem, I am looking forward to your submission" *chuckless*

 A paladin of Toran would be attempting to emulate the god they love, so the reason to deviate from his favor would have to be intense. Just saying "this suits me better" to me sounds like a thinly disguised 1d10 is better than 1d8....
...You would how ever have zero chance at Champion levels without using the favored weapon of your god.
 

Well the d8 gg d10 argument is not the matter, I could turn it the otherway around with the AC when I am using a shield (I dont want to start a discussion whats better, one handed or twohanded weapon, just saying this is not the reason)

This post is of course too slow also...

I think that neither of the reasons are strong enough to justify a skip from the usual "favored armor/weapon/color" guidelines.

Paladins are tricky ones, as they are the epitome of faith to the deities. It's not a hobby-work... it's selling their own soul for the cause of their gods/goddesses!

Ofcourse I have summed the reason up extremely, the submission and the concept are abit too long... And I know they are tricky. I read several approved submision and (I think) most everything that can be found on LORE and I spended some time with the concept up to now...

Well, I think its is all because I have a very detailed image in my mind about this char (and I know if that one would be approved I would hate NWN lateron because he would not exactly like the image I had on my mind). I had taken alot of time and a lot of thoughts and this image appeared one evening as I lied in my bed and closed my eyes, instead of söeeping I let my thoughts go and thought about this char...
... I guess I will work further on this concept and try to prepare myself that this cahr will not be approved as I planed but that I have to make, as ycleption said, some compromise.
But maybe the CA has a good day when he reads my submissiond...*things* Do they take bribery money?
No serious thank you all for your time and trying to help me!

[miltonyorkcastle]

It's good to hear that you have such vivid images of your characters. It gives me hope that they will be deep, well-rounded, believable characters. It's also good that you realize that not all character concepts fit this world, but that sometimes with a little tailoring they can come aweful close.

If you really want to use two weapons, and your diety's favored weapon is the longsword, just use two longswords. Sure, you'll lose two points of AB, but it's not all that much in the grand scheme of things, and really, it'll make it easier for your character to switch to a shield when necessary.

Really, the sword thing seems to me to just be a mechanical issue. The more important bit that you brought up was about the character's choice to reflect the common man as well as Toran. L already said, the diety's are strict, and want their chosen to reflect where their power comes from. Make sure this happens, and that the devotion to Toran always comes before even the "common man." If your character is true to that, then his desire to connect with the common man can be an acceptable secondary value, especially since  Toran is a diety focused on justice and the protection of the weak.

P.S. no submission is too long (even if the CA's might complain a little now and then  )

[Xirion]

....If you really want to use two weapons...

Did I write two weapons? Well, it should be a twohanded sword...

[miltonyorkcastle]

Heh, when I see two-handed I think of the double-headed sword, but I'm guessing you meant a greatsword. Really, in pen and paper, any weapon can be used two-handed, even a knife. Unfortunately, due to NWN's limitations, you can't use a longsword two-handed; so yeah, you're in a lurch there.

[Xirion]

Oh yes sorry for th confusion, but I guess thats what its called (sry I am from germany and didnt knew the correct translation)

Looks like I have to rewrite the whole concept or try to find an extremely drunken CA who will approve this one

[darkstorme]

*grins*

Our CAs are all sober teetotalers who are always alert and sharp.  I swear.  Never touch a drop.

[Marswipp]

Unless they're drunk on themselves! :p

[Eight-Bit]

I've always just assumed that the favored weapon is the weapon the Paladin would be trained to use by X diety's followers. You would have to provide a solid reason as to why you were trained with a different weapon.

Oh, and let me give a word of advice - shields give that helpful AC boost between getting hit ALL of the time and getting hit most of the time. It's nice to have.

[Xirion]

My cahracter has been allready approved and is at the momrnt online, but thanks for the intrest. I had not expected that much input...

Anyway, I know about that AC bonus and I know that there are pros and cons, maybe more cons  (I really dont know). But I as I stated it is that image I have in mind. My chra. A person, with many small and maybe unimportant charactatristics, like the appearance and the weapon. I was never one of that gamer who follow a specific build ortrying to get the most powerfull paladin. My image and RP reasons come first.

Thanks for reading,
Xirion