Author Topic: Jack of all trades.... (Read 603 times)

Guardian 452 · « **on:** September 08, 2005, 12:43:00 am »

... Master of none.

This is some radical thinking mind you.

What if people progressed down a more defined path in crafting?

Say woodcraft, smithing, scribing, food prep, etc etc....

This would mean that those with buffs would no longer be self sufficient crafters in nearly if not all trades just because they can buff their stats.

When you begin crafting you choose a main catagory like woodworking, smithing, tailoring etc.... then your restricted in what you can and cannot due....

Example a Woodcrafter would not be able to make Platearmor, or Scribe scrolls, or make pies (LOL)

My thinking is this could lead to more player interaction and RP (which is what everyone comes here for).

Kick it around a while everyone.

G-452

FlameStrike · « **Reply #1 on:** September 08, 2005, 01:19:00 am »

Or add a feat requirement for crafting certain items in certain crafts. For instance adding certain class-specific feats like say, Turn Undead would make those items exclusively craftable by specific classes.

Vincent · « **Reply #2 on:** September 08, 2005, 01:36:00 am »

Not that I use the crafting system all that much, but I could deal with the class-restriction on the crafting, but I'm not a fan of restricting us once we pick one.

People change careers all the time. I feel like the craft-locking is too restrictive.

slipperhero · « **Reply #3 on:** September 08, 2005, 06:49:00 am »

Perhaps you could only specialize in one tradeskill, lets say armor crafting.
When you have choosen the tradeskill for your character, all other tradeskills would be capped at a certain craftinglevel (5 for example), and you can only advance in your chosen tradeskill above craftinglvl 5.

That way a scribe would have to buy scrolls from the baker and the the weaponsmith buy his axehandles from a woodcrafter.

regnus · « **Reply #4 on:** September 08, 2005, 07:12:00 am »

Along this same line, what about making recipes that are only available to certain races? I know it is probably a man power thing and if I knew what I was doing, I would help. Anyway, it would be cool if say there was a resource only workable by dwarves or elves or something. I think that would induce more RP as well since you would have to find one of that race to make the item for you.

As to the idea of specializing in a craft, I think there should be an option there that allows specialization. If you take it, you maybe get a minor bonus to that trade and others are capped at a certain level. 5 may be a little low though. Also, maybe have recipes only available to specialists. Kinda like the magic schools where they get bonuses to their school but lose the opposite school. Anyway, make it an option not the only way.

As a side note, I just downloaded the CNR from nwvault. I am sifting through it and trying to figure it out as I go. I may eventually be able to help.

forsettii · « **Reply #5 on:** September 08, 2005, 07:41:00 am »

Actually there is Class and Race restrictions built in to Layonara version of CNR. I forget now who actually did it been a long time. But they also did the exceptional crafting stuff.

Just time making the items and recipes.

FlameStrike · « **Reply #6 on:** September 08, 2005, 11:05:00 am »

I wouldn't really like to see any crafts restricted, it would be a lot cooler if only certain high-level or even mid-level items would be restricted.
Like needing an experienced dwarven craftsman to get that special blade or armor, a master elven enchanter to get that staff charged up like it should, an elite rogue to get that deadly trap done for you, etc etc...

Talan Va'lash · « **Reply #7 on:** September 08, 2005, 07:47:00 pm »

Bows of the hunter can only be made by rangers, I think dwarven waraxes can only be made by dwarves.

A while ago when a bunch of the new higher end more unique craftable items got it it was a part of a push for racial items. In the end it was decided (not sure if it was by the team or just L, L posted the decision) that they would not be race specific, that that wasnt the direction that they wanted to go in.

I rather agree. Few items should be restricted by race (their use at least, I'm not so against them only being craftable by certain races.) Its no fun to not be able to use an item because you chose to be x race, and it gives rogues a bit of an advantage because they can use them all anyway.

A lot of crafts and recepies are already restricted by class, by the tools they use and the spells they require. Every couple months a new thread starts complaining about how x class cant do x because they don't have the proficiency for the tool. heh, I find it strange that it was just suggested that more crafting feats be required after seeing the argument made many times that no one should have to take a feat for crafting.

A system like G suggested when he started this thread would be interesting. I'd see it working more like, you choose your specialty, and then recieve +20% xp in all related crafts when crafting and -20% in others or something more flexible like that. A bonus and penalty, but not a flat out restriction (which doesnt make rp sense anyway, where as the 20% does, you learn faster the craft you're specialized at.)

But I think anything like this would definitely have to wait untill the next implementation.

-TV

Lalaith Va'lash · « **Reply #8 on:** September 08, 2005, 08:03:00 pm »

"and it gives rogues a bit of an advantage because they can use them all anyway."-TV
Don't forget bards.
And thats only if they spend skill points in UMD.
I don't think its an "advantage" though, its balanced in itself, since they get those points in exchange for say.. the extra feats that fighters have? or somthing else.. for another class...

regnus · « **Reply #9 on:** September 08, 2005, 10:01:00 pm »

Talan

I meant only craftable by certain races. The items made would not have those restrictions on them.

jrizz · « **Reply #10 on:** October 10, 2005, 05:18:00 pm »

The whole idea of buffing to increase your chances in crafting should be done away with. (this is were you all throw rocks at me). Casting str on someone to help mine is one thing, it fits well. but casting str to increase your chance of success when crafting does not make sense to me. These types of magics are unstable and should not lend themselves to crafting. I have done this from time to time and each time felt it was cheating in some way.

Cheers,
John

Dorganath · « **Reply #11 on:** October 10, 2005, 05:27:00 pm »

It's not exactly "cheating". While buffs increase your chance for success, they also reduce the XP you get for succeeding.
And so while you may be relying on artificial means to bolster your own skills, your success is also partially artificial, and you don't really learn as much as you would doing it the hard way.
Just another perspective, is all. I personally don't buff either out of personal choice, unless I really, really need to succeed.....which is rare.

Filatus · « **Reply #12 on:** October 10, 2005, 07:28:00 pm »

I think the xp loss balances it quite well. Daeron buffs and he does't really progress in crafting with much speed. Level 7 in gemcrafting is my highest skill after about 4 months.

Ar7 · « **Reply #13 on:** October 11, 2005, 10:18:00 am »

Similar topics have been started from time to time and I always remember that Ghost was against any restrictions, well so am I. You seem to forget why people come to Layonara and what do they seek here. People are here to have fun, for some it is the RP, for some it is the adventure and for others, like myself, Ghost and many others, it is crafting. We do it, because we enjoy it or due to some circumstances, like a nearly empty server during the time we play. Most of the time I am online, I craft, I do believe many others do the same thing. If you take it away from us, we will probably play a lot less, as you take the fun away.

Ar7

Wintersheart · « **Reply #14 on:** October 11, 2005, 11:02:00 am »

Aye Ar7!

I also enjoy crafting very much - feels good to create and for me quite exciting once I create something new.

Also if level restrictions were suddenly imposed many people would be left halfway. Spent a lot of time, effort and money, but not able to progress further and make something truly worthwhile.

Falreign · « **Reply #15 on:** October 11, 2005, 01:40:00 pm »

Restrictions, bad idea. Specialization Modifiers good idea. I also remember there being race or class related modifiers to increase your chance at something by tens of percentages. For instance gnome cooking isn't very well liked (Really who else digs turnips?) while halflings seem to have a sense for many different types of food. Humans tended to have the least amount of changes.

Filatus · « **Reply #16 on:** October 11, 2005, 05:17:00 pm »

If you start limiting on crafts, you're really going the wrong way. I'm sorry, but I haven't seen any craftable item yet that could not have been made by AD&D humans. Orcs at this moment can not craft I believe, I'm sure that goes for a few others. But to say only elves can enchant a certain thing, nonsense.

I do like the idea of losing access to a particular craft when starting another craft, but the problem is a lot of epics are already at the top in multiple crafts. It would be unfair to take their crafts away, but it would also be unfair to leave it for them, but restrict the others.

Except for Falreign's race related modifiers (abilities are often class determined so the class related system is already used), I don't really see any suggestion that is actually better than the current system.

EDIT: deleted double typings

lunchboxkilla · « **Reply #17 on:** October 18, 2005, 04:38:00 am »

A bit of lazyness and a bit pf RP has pushed Celgar into being an enchanter only guy. Yes he does limited crafting in other skills but it for what he needed to enchant. Though he's high in smelting and low in smithing... I need a craft practice and used to enchant ingots to get better at enchanting rods and what not..

I think and this is my personal though... That it should be based on INT.. how many skills you can have... 8-11.. only one.. I mean people with subpar int can figure out how to work a machine or what not...

If this doesn't work... how bout 8-11 one skill can advance to 25 while the restr may mill around at say 5.. and then all levels go up per INT bonues like the Language mods. so an int mod of +2 whould let said player go up another another 5 levels in other crafting if they learned it by doing it over and over..
-

Harloff · « **Reply #18 on:** October 18, 2005, 05:05:00 am »

Well i don't think that is a good idea, since you often need several trades in order to have one. e.g. if you wanna be a smith you would have to be a smelter, and if you wanna wood craft you would need to food craft etc.. I think all craftings would end in a stand still if we all needed to find one of the few experts on the related trades or go find a wizard since they would be the only crafters left.

Wintersheart · « **Reply #19 on:** October 18, 2005, 05:44:00 am »

Quote

lunchboxkilla - 10/18/2005 1:38 PM
I think and this is my personal though... That it should be based on INT.. how many skills you can have... 8-11.. only one.. I mean people with subpar int can figure out how to work a machine or what not...

If this doesn't work... how bout 8-11 one skill can advance to 25 while the restr may mill around at say 5.. and then all levels go up per INT bonues like the Language mods. so an int mod of +2 whould let said player go up another another 5 levels in other crafting if they learned it by doing it over and over..
-

NO NO NO

If this is implemented lots of chars including mine will be invalid or stuck at levels where I have spent a great effort getting, but unable to progress further.

Some players like Ar7 and I are primarily crafters (We do also do quests). Much of my RP revolves around crafting and most of my no cleric interaction is from crafting.