Ideas from other PW servers

[Pen N Popper]

Since NWN Layo is going away, these are probably moot points but I still think they're worth considering for the next generation too.

Hourly XP
I truly found "hourly" XP to be quite liberating.  It wasn't major, but a slow trickle of XP let me mix RP with adventure in a nice balance.  With hourly XP I felt that my time on the server was valuable whether I was bashing or sipping whisky with a fellow dwarf.

On Layo I would say that 1/4 of a quest hours worth of XP per RL hour would not unbalance things.  (If it takes 40 hours of quest XP to level, then it would take 160 hours of playtime to level.)

I am aware that the general opinion of the remaining Layo players is that XP should be "earned" through quests and combat.  However, I still am a firm believer in "story over combat."  A player that RPs for four hours entirely through emotes is not less deservant than a basher that soloed a bunch of giants.  Call me crazy but I'd rather get hourly XP at the combat academy than mindlessly bashing across a continent.

Crafting
I made a post describing a different level progression in CNR.  I really liked the crafting level tied with character level, but I was never big into crafting so I'm  probably biased.

There have been discussions here about naming items.  One of the systems I saw automatically did this by naming CNRed items like this:  "Bronze Shortsword [Bumblebee]".  No exploits possible, just the crafter's name automatically added.

Death
Corpses are fun!  To fit it into Layo's style, I would say drop a corpse that someone could pick up.  It would be like moving the gravestone.  Obviously a very complicated system that would need to be spec'ed out to avoid exploits.


Please don't take this as a "rant."  Consider it information gleaned from other experiences.  I chose to return to playing on Layo knowing fully that my primary PC would likely never gain another level, never become a WL, and certainly never have more of an impact than he already does.  Layonara is a fun world, with fun people, and with a fun future that I want to participate in just as it is.

I would also like to say that the community here as represented on the forums is far more mature than elsewhere.  I am paraphrasing Leanthar here but he once said something like, "I would rather have a server of ten exceptional RPers enjoying themselves, than a server of sixty hack & slashers."  That is absolutely correct.  Massive player numbers only increase the possibility of immaturity.  All of you players, past and present, deserve a pat on the back.

[Harlas Ravelkione]

Regarding the hourly xp rewards I cannot help but think of the possibilities to abuse the system. You play, and when you go to sleep you leave your character standing around. Even when going on a week of vacation, simply leave your character standing in your house.

[Pen N Popper]

Yes, the hourly XP system is a tricky one.  On the one hand you'd like to reward players while on the other hand you don't want to encourage certain habits.

I've seen three styles:

1.  The super slow trickle -- This is the accumulation of XP at such a ridiculously low rate as to be almost negligible.  I say almost because sometimes a little still feels welcome.  There were no penalties for just staying online but this was a low player number server (less than 30 max and more like 10 normally).

2.  The please stay online trickle -- This server actually encouraged people to stay online even while AFK.  They used this to stay near the top of the player number list on gamespy.  Not a bad idea as that is what I (and I would assume others) look for when hoping to find an RP server:  Bodies to RP with.  Of course seeing ten comatose PCs sitting around the town's campfire was rather discouraging.

3.  The ranked trickle -- This one actually makes the most sense to me and is pretty clever.  Each player is given a RP rank which is equivalent to the amount of incremental XP they'd get every six minutes.  They had 0, 10, 20, 30, and 40 ranks.  A 20 was the normal for most and there were only a handful of 40s.  Now here's the kicker, your ranking can also go down.  Have a 20 and are caught AFK?  Drop to zero.  

The problem with penalizing is that it can generate friction between the playerbase and the team.  "I deserve a 30!  Why do they have a 40?  Blah blah."  The difference on Layo, I think, is that I suspect if a system was put in place here that clearly defined rules and standards would likely be posted at the same time.  On the server I saw the ranked trickle no one was really sure how to get their rank improved, or what was a violation, etc.

I think in the end, I would still go back to this:  Reward the behavior you want to encourage.  When someone spends three hours alone in a player run tavern waiting because they're dedicated to bringing it to life, should they be rewarded with XP?  Is that behavior that should be encouraged or should it be left entirely up to the player if they find it fun enough to do again just as it is?  Rewards shape the world in so many ways, both in player actions and which players find an enjoyable home.

I'm quite curious to see the next generation Layo's reward system.

[Dorganath]

You are correct in that it is too late in the Layonara NWN development cycle to even consider these kinds of major changes...and yeah, they'd be major.

All I will say is that the next version of Layonara will be vastly different in a lot of ways, and as such, those differences may or may not touch on the concepts you listed above.

[Xirion]

You know whatthe best reward for RP is to me?
Fun. No matter if a GM drops a creature in my way who wants "shinies" or sitting around a campfire with a baby and talking... it is the fun.

It is allways a nice bonus if a GM drops in and say "nice rp here are x-points xp", but I would prefer a good time without xp. I enjoy it to laugh when arguing with other PC's or about the creativity of GM's. Thats the best reward.

EDIT: oh, but let me add that it is allways good to have a look left or right to what the others are doing and learn from that

[Pen N Popper]

True!  Layo does have quite a group of creative folks.

[LynnJuniper]

This may sound weird. but in the new layonara I vote for an option to turn XP Gain off from player side. Or to implement something like the "Rested XP" In World of Warcraft (Yeah I know, here I go again).

With Rested XP, certain places (usually towns) are considered Rest Zones. This can also be used to encourage RP (Not saying in a small community where there's a potential of abuse, but if Layo ever goes highly commercial I don't think it'll be avoidable). What the rested XP does is calculate somehow how long you've stayed in a town, and then, the next time you go out to adventure, doubles your XP gain from monsters for a set period of time. (It also works while you're offline though to encourage those who dont get much play time to keep playing/paying >>; )

I just wish there was a way to shut XP off temporarily in game >_< Some people like to stay on track with their friends despite different play times.

[Harlas Ravelkione]

I suggest that you ask a GM in game to remove some xp from you if you want to go slower through levels. There is no problem with that and we are happy to help out

[Xirion]

Feel free to add hers xp to mine

[Eight-Bit]

I'll take some too!

[Dorax Windsmith]

Good discussion here...*pats Pen N Popper on the back* you are always thinking out of the box and that's great!  I really like the idea of reward the behavior you want to encourage and I know that L and the team try to do this...the World Leader system is one way but it is an extremely slow process (about a year minimum for time requirements).  And please don't take offense, I'm not saying that this hasn't or doesn't happen but I think it could take place more frequently.  One way I think the server could implement a quicker reward system without having to do any programming or updates is do a little more mentoring.  I've seen player and GM led "training" sessions where the focus was proper RPing and during quests as a new player I remember getting help from others in tells.  I've also experienced a few GM's who have watched for a while and then popped in a "talked" about what you were doing when it was either a blatant rule violation, bad RP, or pushing the rules.  But consider this...what if a GM pointed out something via tell to a player or multiple players like "the level spread in the party is too large" or "I haven't seen much RP happening" and then watched to see if one or more players took action to change what was happening.  If the player or players took action and the GM were to give some reward (XP, some short IG interaction, or an impromptu mini-quest, etc.) then this may have a more positive affect on the way players and characters develop.  On the other hand, every experienced GM has probably given hints at one time or another and been ignored and had to resort to "other measures"...totally understandable.  I recognize that this may be a bit more time consuming but I think an investment of time here will improve the player base overall.

Oh, and I shouldn't forget to give a big thumbs up and a thank you to all the GM's for your time and dedication to the server.  Layonara wouldn't be what it is today without you...so keep up the good work.

[LynnJuniper]

Go ahead Harlas, give them some of my XP. I'm not doing anything with it.

[Falonthas]

::tosses his staff into the hat for rhynns xp toss aways:

[Xirion]

 But consider this...what if a GM pointed out something [...]  If the player or players took action and the GM were to give some reward (XP, some short IG interaction, or an impromptu mini-quest, etc.) then this may have a more positive affect on the way players and characters develop.

Don't they do exactly this?

[Falonthas]

yes they do and they do it incredibly

even when they are new and forget to remap the save key
we still love em

[Tanman]

@Dorax: I do this especially with the interactions recently. But thats after another time as a pose to the same sitting that I talked to them and I see them RP better.