Attention Skalds! Important!

[Dorganath]

With the pending update, coming as soon as I can get it out, the Skald PrC will be undergoing some fairly major changes. These changes are intended to improve the PrC and to fix some problems that the class had overall.  Among the most significant is that the Skald PrC is becoming a 5 level PrC rather than a 10 level PrC.
  This will significantly impact any current characters with Skald levels.  As such, we will need specially handle those active characters who have Skald levels so that they will work properly and as intended.
  Any currently active Skald characters are entitled to releveling or a full rebuild.  We know that the previous design on the PrC might have led some people who made Skald characters to make different choices for their attribute, feat and skill point selections, choices which now are not as applicable.  As this change is beyond the control of the players, we're granting this one-time option for all Skalds who wish to pursue it.
  I have already spoken to one such character.  There is at least one other active Skald in the list.  For anyone who I have not yet spoken with, please PM me so we can discuss your options.
  For reference (and this will be updated on LORE soon), the new Skald specs are as follows:
  Abilities: Level 1: Bellow (mass fear). Level 2: Chant (mass Blind/Deaf). Level 3: Song of Exhaustion (mass slow and -1/2 charisma mod to attack debuff, ) Level 4: Bleed. (direct damage) Level 5: Wail. (death effects)  All song abilities use “bard songs” with Wail taking 2 uses.  Wail: DC: 10 + skald level + cha mod Bleed: Damage: Skald level * Cha mod, no save Other abilities: DC: 10 + ½ character level + Cha mod   -------------------------------------------------------------  Terrifying Bellow: Type of Feat: Class Prerequisite: Skald 1. Specifics: This enables the Skald to cause fear and havok in the midst of combat, he is able to send his enemies fleeing before him when he screams his war cry. Use of this ability reduces the character's remaining Bard Song uses by one.  Deafening Chant: Type of Feat: Class Prerequisite: Skald 2. Specifics: This enables the Skald to render his opponents deaf, from a constant numbing chant. Vibrations temporarily blind and deafen all those failing their save. Use of this ability reduces the character's remaining Bard Song uses by one.  Song of Exhaustion: Type of Feat: Class Prerequisite: Skald 3. Specifics: . When the Skald sings this ominous tune, his opponents often find it difficult to move, reducing both their rate of travel and their ability to attack effectively. Use of this ability reduces the character's remaining Bard Song uses by one.   Make them Bleed: Type of Feat: Class Prerequisite: Skald 4. Specifics: The Skald is begining to truly master his voice, and is able to pierce the eardrums of all the foes near him, causing massive hemoraging and occasionally even death. There is no saving throw against this ability. Use of this ability reduces the character's remaining Bard Song uses by one.  Broken Wail: Type of Feat: Class Prerequisite: Skald 5. Specifics: This is the pinnacle of the Skalds power, he is literally able to sing so strong and loud that he can snuff out the life of many creatures. All those within hearing must make a save or be stricken dead as the Skald breaks their very will to live. Use of this ability reduces the character's remaining Bard Song uses by two.

[FlameStrike]

I have a question, will the Wail ability bypass the Death Ward spell protection? Thanks

[Dorganath]

Would you believe...I'm not sure. I'm drawing a complete blank on the code, so I'll have to look when I get home.

[D Blaze]

Would a Silence Spell nullify all of the skalds powers, and would a deafened character be immune to effects 1, 3 and 5 as well?(An already deafened character could still be blinded by 2, and I guess 4 physically affect targets, but everything else still has to be heard.)

[Dorganath]

Silence  seems to affect the ability to speak within the area of affect, rather than actually creating complete silence (though I suppose it depends on how you interpret it).
  As things stand, Silene should prevent the Skald from using these abilities if within the area of effect, but would not necessarily guard against the effects.
  Keep in mind also that Skald abilities now are more about the force of their voices rather than any effects from hearing them in the normal sense. With the exception of the Fear effect, all of these have physical effects upon those within range.

[Dorganath]

FlameStrike - 9/6/2006  8:38 AM  I have a question, will the Wail ability bypass the Death Ward spell protection? Thanks

 It's a Fortitude save vs. Death.

[lonnarin]

Do we have the option to rebuild without skald levels?  I'd rather trade them all in for pure bard levels, as none of the special abilities ever had any practical use for me.  I'd keep deafening and blinding myself while casting mass fear on my party, when targetted bard-spell versions would have been far more effective.

[Talan Va'lash]

lonnarin - 9/7/2006  3:08 AM

Do we have the option to rebuild without skald levels?  I'd rather trade them all in for pure bard levels, as none of the special abilities ever had any practical use for me.  I'd keep deafening and blinding myself while casting mass fear on my party, when targetted bard-spell versions would have been far more effective.

Look over the changes before you decide. I think you'll find them far more relevant to appropriate CR combat now.

I even think the new skald will be more fun to play as well, since using your bard songs rather than having x/day usage gives more decision and strategy to playing one.

I also like how the buffing skald abilities were removed, putting the PrC's focus solely on offensive songs. With this change the skald definitely outshines the bard when it comes to offensive stuff, but is weaker in defensive/buffing abilities. As it should be!

Although its hardly needed I give my 100% stamp of approval on the skald changes. I'm going out of my way to say this because I'm usually the nitpicker that will point out things I don't like even in things that I like overall.

Good job to those who worked on hammering out these changes and to Dorg and whoever else who implemented them.

[lonnarin]

I'm pretty certain.  The mass haste was the only thing I found useful.  Everything else just killed people I loved.

[Pankoki]

Lonn, the changes we implemented now only affect enemies, so you shouldn't have to worry about blinding or deafening yourself or your friends any longer. At least that was part of the rebalancing we did. I'm not 100% sure if Dorg tested this, but it is amongst the list of changes. I'm sure he will post when he gets back.

[Olme]

I also asked Dorg to check if the duration of the Bard song affects the duration of the effects (fear, deaf/blind, slow) it causes.
So would having the Lingering Song feat for example extend the desired affect ?

[Dorganath]

Uh yeah...the new/updated abilities are not about harming one's party. They're intended not to, in fact. I cannot confirm right now that this is truly the case, as I cannot look at the code, but I am fairly certain that the new songs do not affect friendlies. I will of course verify that later when I can.
  The Skald's change reflects a move to a more offense-oriented class. Clearly things that make one's enemy run in fear, for example, do no good if the make your friends do the same. This was one of the acknowledged short-comings of the class, and one that was specifically addressed.
  As for the usefulness...the old DCs were low...too low. That's been improved significantly. That's not to say they'll work on all creatures, but they have a much broader utility now, and they do scale to a degree as the character gains levels and/or ability points in Charisma.
  To answer your question about having the option to relevel only as Bard.... well, that's a character change, so you'd have to have it approved. But, I think you'll find that the abilties are useful, more useful, even if they have the same names.
  Lastly, to repeat, the intention is that these do not affect party members/friendlies. If they do, then that is a bug, and we'll fix it. It is not an intended effect.
  Have some faith in the balancing and development folks!  

[Dorganath]

Olme - 9/7/2006  7:26 AM  I also asked Dorg to check if the duration of the Bard song affects the duration of the effects (fear, deaf/blind, slow) it causes.  So would having the Lingering Song feat for example extend the desired affect ?

 Lingering song does not currently affect the duration of Skald abilities. I don't believe this was specifically addressed in the rebalancing. Maybe it's an oversight, maybe it's intentional. I defer the question of whether it should have an effect back to Mr. Pankoki.

[Dorganath]

Oh...and there's some cool sound effects for the abilities now. Not that melodic bard song nonsense.

[lonnarin]

That's certainly a relief!  I'll give it a try and tell you guys what I think then, I don't think I'll need to rebuild anything since I only have 4 skald levels so far.  Now you've peeked my interest!  A few more questions...

1) Will Skalds gain any new songs/day during the 5 levels of the PrC?  Will the power of the bardsongs increase with Skald level, or is that totally dependant on pure-bard levels?  I think the old version had some sort of staggered theme to song/level progression.

2) Is this a typo?  It still shows the 1-10 progression of the old class and uses/day.  

Under Deafening Chant: "This is usable once per day, and increases to twice per day at 6th and three times per day at 10th."

3) On Class Skills: Any chance you could include Intimidate to the list before the update? It certainly fits the whole "My voice is the bastion of death and fear!" feel to the class.  (and not enough people take tons of social skills anyhow)  Gather information might also be another good one, certainly "heroic-tale" friendly.  Picking pockets and sneaking on the other hand seem a little less skaldy and more bard-like.

4) Is broken wail going to be a necromantic effect subject to protection spells like Shadow Shield and the like, or more like an instant-death or monster effect akin to disintigration rays or drown?  It's an interesting toss-up, whether the wail is physically snuffing them, doing it with dark/negative energies or affecting morale to convince them to die. (of course it says fort save, so probably not an enchant-style instadeath like weird)

5) When Roleplaying the various voice-effect abilities, how should we depict the way our song-effects sound?  I imagine the ones that deafen them and make them bleed are incredibly loud, the wail kind of like a mournful and shrieking banshee wail, and terrifying bellow to have a weird spooky "demon-voice" like the Bene Gesserit Mother in Dune.

6) If you put your hand in the box and enjoy the feeling of your own psionically burning flesh, is it so wrong?

7) Is Farros Galdor the 1st Skald Ever?  I have a sneaking suspiscion that he is, since I was the one who reported the "Skald scares and deafens himself bug" way back.  Just curious, bragging rights are at stake!

8: Is song of Exhaustion RPed as physically making them tired, or more like a Song of Lethargy that makes them depressed and lazy?

[Dorganath]

lonnarin - 9/7/2006  11:40 AM That's certainly a relief! I'll give it a try and tell you guys what I think then, I don't think I'll need to rebuild anything since I only have 4 skald levels so far. Now you've peeked my interest! A few more questions...

 Yes, actually, you will, because your 4 Skald levels give different feats than the new 4 skald levels.      

1) Will Skalds gain any new songs/day during the 5 levels of the PrC? Will the power of the bardsongs increase with Skald level, or is that totally dependant on pure-bard levels? I think the old version had some sort of staggered theme to song/level progression.

 Skald levels do not  improve one's bardic abilities. Rather the PrC's effects are improved by increases in bardic abilities.  Everything is based on bardsongs in terms of uses, levels and CHA bonuses.  Only Bleed and Wail depend on Skald levels, which obviously cap out early.  The other three use character levels, and so they continue to improve as the character takes levels. Also, more bard levels means more songs/day, and that helps the skald abilities.
 

2) Is this a typo?  It still shows the 1-10 progression of the old class and uses/day.        Under Deafening Chant: "This is usable once per day, and increases to twice per day at 6th and three times per day at 10th."

 Yes it is!  I had corrected it elsewhere, but not here for some reason.  Nice catch though.  I've fixed it above. It follows the other songs in that they consume one bard song per use.    

3) On Class Skills: Any chance you could include Intimidate to the list before the update? It certainly fits the whole "My voice is the bastion of death and fear!" feel to the class. (and not enough people take tons of social skills anyhow) Gather information might also be another good one, certainly "heroic-tale" friendly. Picking pockets and sneaking on the other hand seem a little less skaldy and more bard-like.

 Yes, good idea.  It can, and shall, be done.    

4) Is broken wail going to be a necromantic effect subject to protection spells like Shadow Shield and the like, or more like an instant-death or monster effect akin to disintigration rays or drown? It's an interesting toss-up, whether the wail is physically snuffing them, doing it with dark/negative energies or affecting morale to convince them to die. (of course it says fort save, so probably not an enchant-style instadeath like weird)

 Broken Wail uses a Foritude save vs. Death.  I think the description of this ability kind of sums up how it works.    

5) When Roleplaying the various voice-effect abilities, how should we depict the way our song-effects sound? I imagine the ones that deafen them and make them bleed are incredibly loud, the wail kind of like a mournful and shrieking banshee wail, and terrifying bellow to have a weird spooky "demon-voice" like the Bene Gesserit Mother in Dune.

 *grins* I've added what I think are appropriate sound effects for each of these abilities.  Wail is something like 5 sounds played simultaneously. Oh, and most of the sounds are gender-specific.    

6) If you put your hand in the box and enjoy the feeling of your own psionically burning flesh, is it so wrong?

 Nah.    

7) Is Farros Galdor the 1st Skald Ever? I have a sneaking suspiscion that he is, since I was the one who reported the "Skald scares and deafens himself bug" way back. Just curious, bragging rights are at stake!

 Nope.  There's another who has 8 levels in Skald, another with 1, and a couple who are no longer active.
  Oh, and this information should now be updated on LORE  for your future reference

[Dorganath]

Oh and this just in....
  Lingering song will improve the duration of Skald songs to which it applies. Bleed and Wail don't really make sense, because Bleed is a one-time damage and Wail is..well...death, which tends to last a very long time.

[lonnarin]

AWESOME!  Now I'm really pumped about the new changes!  One more thing, Broken Wail on Lore currently says a Fort Save is needed.

Go go go!  Make my character even cooler!

[Dorganath]

lonnarin - 9/7/2006  12:16 PM  One more thing, Broken Wail on Lore currently says a Fort Save is needed.

 BAH! Another typo on my part. Fort save vs. Death is correct...and edited above *sighs*

[minerva]

Lingering song would be a disadvantage on the Bleed feat as you cannot sing a new song till the current one is finished.  This is how it works with Curse song and it's direct damage.  Just a FYI bardy thing ...  *wanders away*