Author Topic: bloodfall sword (Read 680 times)

jrizz · « **on:** November 30, 2006, 05:34:58 PM »

What is the point (no pun) of this sword? it is +2 attack and +1 damage and has a level req of 14. Well an addy sword is +2 +2 and has a level req of 10. The bloodfall is a longsword but it is really light so is it treated as a light weapon for dual wielding? or is it still a med weapon? Any thoughts on the value of the Bloodfall sword?

osxmallard · « **Reply #1 on:** November 30, 2006, 05:49:31 PM »

It has a very nice description. It would be a great item with a lower level requirement like 8 or 9.

Dorganath · « **Reply #2 on:** November 30, 2006, 05:54:16 PM »

It was an item added for flavor and not necessarily its might. It's "value" lies in its description, flavor and atmosphere.

jrizz · « **Reply #3 on:** November 30, 2006, 07:32:16 PM »

it just seems to me that in a world where we have inventory management issues as it is adding items for flavor could be done it a better way. It has a great description for sure prehaps it belongs in on display somewhere and not as a drop item. It would be cool to see items like this hanging in the court house or some of the inns. Just an idea.

Dorganath · « **Reply #4 on:** November 30, 2006, 07:58:40 PM »

Um...a lot of people on the Project and GM Teams spent a lot of time and effort into making 128 new items a while back that were uniquely Layonara, with histories and really unique properties. They were made to be interesting and some were even completely useless (a rusty red light dagger comes to mind) but still interesting. But their utility was secondary to their flavor and the richness and depth they bring to the world. Some even tell a tale, or enough of one to make one wonder about the rest of the story. The star dusts were a part of this effort, as were many, many items that I see happily residing in the inventories of various characters.
I'm not sure where it was ever written that every piece of loot taken from the corpses of the various creatures in the world had to be something extraordinary. Sure, it's "convention" but then there's really no reason why goblins or orcs or hill giants would have really nice stuff in their pockets.
So having said that, if they're clogging your inventory or you just don't care about them, sell them, pawn them or throw them away. And when V3 comes out and we have even more uniquely Layonara items (and yes, we are making even more such items), just don't bother picking them up.

Talan Va'lash · « **Reply #5 on:** November 30, 2006, 08:17:49 PM »

I modified the properties on this sword slightly for Xora's Vial (the bloodfall makes an appearance there too.) I just gave it +2 attack +1 damage slashing. Which is exactly the same end result as the current weapon but at 2 or 3 levels lower. Iirc it's still higher than a +2 longsword, which is better... but it's better than 4 lvls higher and is less likely to confuse people (I've been asked dozens of times by people who were confused by the bloodfall... mostly because they assumed we wouldn't do something that didn't make sense hehe.)

Anyway, I think the reason this particular issue has come up so many times in the past half-dozen months is because level req is an OOC concept and it's odd when it gets inconsistant. Unfortunately, NWN doesn't handle it all that intelligently and we have limited flexibility to tailor it to our needs.

Polak76 · « **Reply #6 on:** November 30, 2006, 08:58:50 PM »

Ramanon got a sword from the black Wizards which was called: Corath Wounds - Iron shortsword +1 and Wounding DC 11-13..something like that. Even though at level 20 it was useless compared to what was out there I had such a sentimental attachment to it that I basically wouldn't leave home without it. It was only in the end that I opted for something much stronger, but i still kept it for RP value or heirlooms from those whom followed the path of Corath.
Therefore as afore mentioned, its more than stats that make this world enjoyable.

Frelinder · « **Reply #7 on:** December 01, 2006, 02:06:51 AM »

Hmm.. Does the +2 attack stack with GMW on this sword?

Weeblie · « **Reply #8 on:** December 01, 2006, 03:36:50 AM »

No, Enhancement Bonuses and Attack Bonuses aren't stackable. Only the highest one counts.

Talan Va'lash · « **Reply #9 on:** December 01, 2006, 10:18:29 AM »

Quote

Weeblie - 12/1/2006 4:36 AM

No, Enhancement Bonuses and Attack Bonuses aren't stackable. Only the highest one counts.

correct.

jrizz · « **Reply #10 on:** December 01, 2006, 03:30:36 PM »

oi folks ease up

there was no intent to say that the history and flavor of the items was not cool. Many of the items such as the rusty dagger, stone club, rusty chain mail and such are cool back drop. My question was around the bloodfall which is not in the same "flavor" cat as these other items. The bloodfall falls just short of being a useful item, that is why so many people ask about it.

Dorganath · « **Reply #11 on:** December 01, 2006, 03:44:57 PM »

Quote

jrizz - 11/30/2006 9:32 PM
it just seems to me that in a world where we have inventory management issues as it is adding items for flavor could be done it a better way.

Quote

jrizz - 11/30/2006 9:32 PM
Many of the items such as the rusty dagger, stone club, rusty chain mail and such are cool back drop. My question was around the bloodfall which is not in the same "flavor" cat as these other items. The bloodfall falls just short of being a useful item, that is why so many people ask about it.

Yeah...not sure how a rusty dagger, stone club or rusty chain mail is any more or less cool than the Bloodfall sword, or why completely useless items are somehow better than others which are more useful but apparently not quite useful enough...or how either group of items has anything to do with inventory management issues. I realize that the objects are not really comparable, but then those new items range from "completely useless" flavor all the way through "Wow! I'm never getting rid of this" flavor. And that was the point of the entire group: flavor.
I don't mean to harp on this issue, but the first comment was kind of a slap in the face to those who actually spent time making these things for everyone's enjoyment.
Again, if you don't find it useful, don't use it. If people wonder about why it is like it is, the correct answer is "flavor". I really can't, and won't, say anything more than that.

Stephen_Zuckerman · « **Reply #12 on:** December 01, 2006, 03:51:02 PM »

I'd like to chip in my two cents.

I happen to love the flavor items I've seen, especially the useless ones... I coveted the Rusty Copper Chainmail for a while, as I wanted Grok to have some... *Chuckles.*

Useful flavor items are great, too (Blue Suede Boots! Belt of Aquisition!), but it's the others that are so nifty... They add to the world, make it richer. The Bloodfall isn't a weapon any of my characters would have a reason to use, but if I picked one up, I'd screencap the description for sure.

Even Chocolate Cake, which is totally useless, is a nifty little collector's item.

jrizz · « **Reply #13 on:** December 01, 2006, 04:52:46 PM »

Holy moly someone IG explained the mechanics value of the Bloodfall to me. I take it all back it is an awesome weapon for some, and should hold very high value. I can see why the level req for it is 14! any less and it would be too powerful.

mumbles · « **Reply #14 on:** December 01, 2006, 05:01:14 PM »

The way ive looked at this bloodfall sword that the

+2 Aattack Bonas is like to Feats (weapon focas and weapon finess)

Yup it only has +1 enhancement Bonas but any Cleric or mage can over ride this with GMW to make it an +2 ,+3 +4 enhancement bonus .

I might be wrong but enhancement Bonas's and AB are different thing so they both shpould count .

As for an Addy weapon ... ive never seen them Give +2 AB before been a whle since ive had one but hay!!!
Which if im correct there just +2 weapons (enhancement bonus)

Talan Va'lash · « **Reply #15 on:** December 01, 2006, 06:33:13 PM »

Quote

mumbles - 12/1/2006 6:01 PM

The way ive looked at this bloodfall sword that the

+2 Aattack Bonas is like to Feats (weapon focas and weapon finess)

Weapon finesse does not do what you imply that it does.

Quote

I might be wrong but enhancement Bonas's and AB are different thing so they both shpould count .

If you read the above thread you'll find that they don't.

Quote

As for an Addy weapon ... ive never seen them Give +2 AB before been a whle since ive had one but hay!!!
Which if im correct there just +2 weapons (enhancement bonus)

Read up on what an enhancement bonus is.

----

Please at least read the thread before posting on a mechanics issue. There is good information in this thread that I would hope would clear up some of the confusion about this item and what it does and does not do, rather than confuse people further.

lonnarin · « **Reply #16 on:** December 01, 2006, 09:42:42 PM »

I think it would be a better sword if it simply had +2 to attack but with NO enhancement bonus for damage and piercing past DR. Make it about level requirement 8, 2 below adamantium. Then it can be assumed that Bloodfalls are not "magic" weapons per say, but rather a very impressive form of masterwork design of Iron, wherein the blacksmiths' desire for an accurate and lighter blade explains why it doesn't have the cutting force of its counterparts of the same metal. Then it would become highly useful for rogues with low attack bonuses and do most of their damage from other means (sneak attack) and for enchanters who rely more upon added elemental and silvered/tatanium damage.

As for the Swashbuckleer's Saber, Both Farros and Rakish swear by them, they are the sweetest custom blades in the game. If you look closely at Farros', he customized it on the loom to have a gilded golden decorative bascinet akin to what spanish nobles used to wear, with the long, thin fencer's blade. I was heavily influenced by Indigo Montoya.

Weeblie · « **Reply #17 on:** December 02, 2006, 02:47:01 AM »

You guys are missing a very, very important feature of Bloodfall.

Decreased weight!

And... It can be found for free!

If my character had used a longsword, I would surely pick Bloodfall before the silly Copper/Rod IV combination and the Addy ones! It's way too cool with having an item with actual story behind it! And the decreased weight basicly means this ain't a normal clumsy whacking device, but one of fine precision instead! A really must have for elves!

Weeblie · « **Reply #18 on:** December 02, 2006, 02:53:54 AM »

Okay... there seems to be a slightly misunderstanding here on what's the difference between Enchancement Bonuses and Attack Bonuses is.

To make it short:

The ONLY difference is damage. Enchancement Bonus gives extra damage too, which Attack Bonus doesn't.

+2 Enhancement Bonus: +2 AB, +2 to bypass DR, +2 Damage (of the correct type for the weapon)
+2 Attack Bonus: +2 AB, +2 to bypass DR (Yes! It's correct! It helps to bypass DR too!)

So, Bloodfall is basicly a "magical" weapon, just like Addy weapons. BUT, doing 1 point less damage!

Edit: Hehe... Blame Bioware to mix the keyword AB.

lonnarin · « **Reply #19 on:** December 02, 2006, 08:58:00 AM »

And accordingly, one less point of Damage Reduction piercing factor. Bjorn's most treasured Mithral hammer can shatter demon flesh like brincks through an egg. Never forget the fine uses of the enhancement bonus. Regardless though, Bloodfall's downfall is that the hardcoding of Bioware does not recognize that overlapping bonuses should not be counted for total item level requirements, and Bloodfall's cool description makes all the more reason to fix this disparity somehow before the sword falls out of popular use. I mean, it's name is Bloodfall, what sweeter name for a sword is that?