Ilsare Skald

[lonnarin]

In terms of whether an Ilsarian would be skald-appropriate or not... that would depend on the manner of skald you were playing.  If you RPed a crazy, blood thirsty madman cursinglord like Farros, then assuredly not.  If however the abilities of the class are merely decibel based rather than hex-based, then I would wager an infinite yes as to them being appropriate to the religion.  A skald isn't just a bundle of cursed songs or blasting sonic wailing... it goes deeper than that, more like a warrior tradition of artistry.  The skald, with their better attack roll and hp mixed with the bardsong abilities and perform skill increases are essentially the paladins of the bard class, if bards were to be compared to clerics.  The skald is essentially a bard who fights better and hones his class abilities into something more useful, much like a paladin using turning abilities for Divine Shield or Divine Might.  If there can be Toranic clerics and paladins, then there most certainly could be Ilsarian bards and skalds.  HOW you use the class abilities is what defines how Ilsarian you are.  What about an Ilsarian skald who would rather scare away the griffons than slaughter them because she thought they were beautiful?  What about a hymn to a band of bandits to "sit there and contemplate a better life" when they are deafened and bypassed peacefully?  Would Ilsare really be so petty to demand that all death be done by arrow to the eyesocket instead of via a song?  I would think she would find that Ironic and asthetically pleasing, actually.  The goddess of art isn't going to weep because you slew the band of murderous orcs setting the peasants on fire, she's more inclined to be pleased if such a task would be done artistically.

Ilsare is not Aeriden.  She preaches people to shoot evil with arrows, and to play beautiful music.  If one could hit two birds with one stone, and make a musical spectacle out of it, all the better.  An Ilsarian skald is therefore much more realistic and common than an Ilsarian fighter, monk, rogue, wizard, sorceror or druid... none of whom can actually sing or play an instrument properly.  Besides, the skald skills work so well with archery in mind, how could she not like it?  Giants running back and forth, screaming and soiling themselves, everybody too blind to rush the archer...  I see a good synergy of tactic and religious creed there.

If she was a peaceful goddess, nobody would draw her with a bow.  You don't see Aeriden clutching anything menacingly in his bas reliefs, do you?

[Dorganath]

@lonnarin
 
 I said "sonic power" not "sonic damage" or "sonic effects". In other words, the power of sound. Whatever the end effect may be (damage, fear, death, etc.), the Skald uses his/her voice to produce sounds which in turn produce those effects. If those effects then require Will saves or Reflex saves or whatever....it hardly matters. The method of delivery is still a rather strong and in-your-face discharge of sonic power/energy produced by the Skald.
 
 Further, it's not about Ilsare being a "peaceful" goddess, but rather about her focus on beauty, music, love and art.  Again, find a convincing way to fit Ilsare's dogma into the harsh way that Skalds use sound, and we might have a winner.

[ycleption]

John Cage?

[jadewillow]

Wow, I guess I started a bit of debate. Thank you all for your very thoughtful remarks. After your remarks and further consideration, Flynn may not have the finesse to pull this off. After all he was raised on the mean streets of Vehl, and would prefer a strong ale and loud tavern ballad, to a beautiful bed of roses. But then again, what is beauty? Someone a lot smarter than I once said it was in the eye of the beholder.

[Acacea]

I think the question that is most relevant in the topic is, why is Flynn an Ilsarian? Not, "he shouldn't be," but rather, what is it that he holds up in Ilsare's dogma as the ideal way of life? Love, beauty, harmony, etc? Something else? I think the answer to that would most determine how he would be going about it all.

It is not so much about where someone grows up or how much beauty they've been privileged with. Indeed, you could make the argument that there are few Ilsarians in noble palaces, as they have only pretty toys and trinkets and hold no particular value over it except to have, because they have always had it and have never known anything else. Beautiful things in those situations are rarely about making something for the sole sake of being beautiful in more ways than one... it's often more about status, reputation, wealth, and fashion.

Someone who has lived in much harsher conditions and seen the ugly undersides of the world may be drawn to beautiful things and the ideals of inspiration and love simply because it makes people smile in a place where smiles are rare. A crippled, grotesquely scarred gruff man may create the most beautiful of illusions with magic...

Regarding Ilsare and skalds, I don't think anyone here has said it was strictly impossible - rather, the debate seems to have been more along the lines of rarity/plausibility. I would disagree with lonnarin, not because I think it is impossible, but I think that denying the challenge of meshing them together by trying to justify how they are in fact perfect compliments defeats the exceptional circumstances they would in fact be... no one made the argument for pacifism in Ilsare's case, though they are not particularly warlike, either. It would just be out of character for an ilsarian way. Out of character situations make for unique individuals, though. I think I would rather acknowledge the rarity of something than try to make it more commonplace...it loses its interesting qualities when we succeed at the latter.

[Pseudonym]

Beldin!