pawn shop limit per character and not overall limit.

[Hellblazer]

I don't know if such a system has been proposed before, but it is rather annoying that as of late, I and many other persons, have no way of selling the junk they acquire on their trips. (ie armor, weapons of low values etc)

What I'm proposing is this.

A pawnshop would only buy for a certain amount per RL day from a character. This means that if the character sells to the pawnshop and reach that pawnshop limit, the next character to come would still be able to sell his things until he reaches his own limit.

Of course that means that players would have to abide by the rules of mauling, and not give things to an other character to sell and ask for the money in return.

But this system would allow for every one to be able to get rid of the things they need to sell, without suffering the excess of a few people who drains the system.

[Dorganath]

The other side of this coin (no pun intended) is that would effectively raise the amount of gold being put into the economy without another means to remove it.  The over-abundance of gold is in fact one of the problems in the economy right now.

One could always donate or throw way the extra "junk" one gets while adventuring...or simply leave the "junk" on the corpse if clutter is the problem.

[Gulnyr]

Without offering an opinion on the idea, I have two quick suggestions that players can try that might help alleviate some of the problem:

1) Stop picking up everything.  A lot of stuff that drops is, indeed, of low value - no one in the group needs it, no one they know needs it, it's unlikely to sell to any other PC, and/or it won't fetch much from a pawner.  It's not really worth hauling it anywhere to get the few gp a pawner would give.

While stuff on the ground can contribute to lag, the clean-up script will take care of it in a minute or two.  Besides, stuff in inventories causes lag, too.

2) Try another pawner.  Seriously.  I've had a few things I've wanted to pawn away for a couple of coins before and the Hemp pawner always seems to be broke, but simply going to the next nearest pawner usually solves the problem.  I don't mean to paint with a broad brush, but there is a sort of laziness among people regarding the pawning of stuff.  It seems to be too much trouble to spend two minutes going to the next nearest pawner to sell things.  Though I'm sure it can happen, I have never, ever been unable to sell things to a pawner outside the main traffic/gathering points (like Port Hempstead now or pre-V3 Hlint).  Be willing to walk a little, or even keep in mind the often-penniless pawners and take a detour to a less frequented one on the way back from wherever you went.

[Lareth]

Would it be possible to have the pawn shops with a split amount of money, say half for low levels 1 thru 10 and the rest for the higher level folks.  That way the low levels who have more of a need for picking up little bitty things would be able to sell them without being impacted when a higher level cleans out the pawn shop by dropping 20 suits of platinum chainmail.

[lonnarin]

Try sailing to places off the beaten path, Like Stort, Rodelm's Isles and the like.  Some of those big hidden cities had a decent pawn rate.

And the problem isnt too much gold, Dorg.  It's too many items being dropped without a crafter ever needing to put a time investment to craft them.  If Mithral and adamantium and Iron weapons found were only made by those people who could craft them, and not found shooting out every oriface of the monsters we fought, then the price of said items would rise, and people who start having to PAY for them, instead of jogging for half an hour.

The very fact that finished CNR good are considered "junk" is the root of the problem!

[Tobias]

Maybe that character shouldn't be making 20 platinum chainmail armors or atleast not stockpiling them until he can hit the pawnshop for a large take in trues. Same could be said for gemcrafter who polishes 50 stack gems to just in turn sell them to the pawnshops and rake in trues that way.
 
 I think if players learned restraint and didn't go to the pawnshop to break it then this situation would rarely occur.
 
 And donating is a good idea. Boost your church's donations and if you don't have a god you could always give praise to Dorand and donate to him.

[lonnarin]

Yeah, I'd like for every person who claims there is too much gold to donate as much of a percentage of their net wealth as Bjorn does.  You should see how fat those wee little orphans are getting!

I'll just leave it at that...

[Hellblazer]

Without offering an opinion on the idea, I have two quick suggestions that players can try that might help alleviate some of the problem:

1) Stop picking up everything.  A lot of stuff that drops is, indeed, of low value - no one in the group needs it, no one they know needs it, it's unlikely to sell to any other PC, and/or it won't fetch much from a pawner.  It's not really worth hauling it anywhere to get the few gp a pawner would give.

While stuff on the ground can contribute to lag, the clean-up script will take care of it in a minute or two.  Besides, stuff in inventories causes lag, too.

2) Try another pawner.  Seriously.  I've had a few things I've wanted to pawn away for a couple of coins before and the Hemp pawner always seems to be broke, but simply going to the next nearest pawner usually solves the problem.  I don't mean to paint with a broad brush, but there is a sort of laziness among people regarding the pawning of stuff.  It seems to be too much trouble to spend two minutes going to the next nearest pawner to sell things.  Though I'm sure it can happen, I have never, ever been unable to sell things to a pawner outside the main traffic/gathering points (like Port Hempstead now or pre-V3 Hlint).  Be willing to walk a little, or even keep in mind the often-penniless pawners and take a detour to a less frequented one on the way back from wherever you went.

on both points.  I do agree that most things like bronze and under should not be picked, up and well I don't pick them up. Unfortunatly, it took me a good round about both servers last week to sell what I had and even then I was stuck with a whole lot left that I effectively dropped as credit in a guild.

Giving things as donations is good, if your character believes in that. Which the one I travel the most with, doesn't. which leaves churches, again, if your char is not following a god, he wouldn't donate.

[osxmallard]

If the pawn shop is out of money people that don't follow gods should donate their stuff to the nearest trashcan.

[Tanman]

Giving things as donations is good, if your character believes in that. Which the one I travel the most with, doesn't. which leaves churches, again, if your char is not following a god, he wouldn't donate.

While these are legitimate reasons for a character not to donate it, I still think its fair to have the limit there. The reason being as Dorganath puts it in his post. The world is not always fair, and things happen. Likewise the world is not designed to accomodate things to allow characters to sell things appropriately.

If our characters have chosen the path -not- to donate then that is their choice and  the world economics or anything else for that matter should not change because of it.

[aragwen]

Rather than letting pawnshops reserve a set amount per player/character I would propose the following:
 
 1. Pawnshops would only purchase certain items it does not have in stock allready (not sure if this create a scripting nighmare). So the pawnshop will only buy one platinum full plate and not twenty. The basic concept is the pawnshop is not a dumping ground but rather a succesful business venture where the owner would only buy what he can resell.
 
 2. In that same mindset the pawnshop should then be able to sell his acquired goods at a profit to others who would like to buy them (likely at a higher price than a crafter would sell it). So if one platinum full plate is in stock another player/character could buy it and therefore opening another spot for someone to sell another one to the owner.
 
 No idea if something like that would be possible, but then we would be in a true pawn environment.

[jan]

Another option would be :

1 : get rid off the split pawnshops and create three or four stores that buy in items that can be resold for an amount off time ( 24-48 hours RL ) , after that a clean-up script removes everything in that global inventory .

2 : Remove items from the drops and replace them with the amount of coins that they would bring in with the pawnshop , excluding things that cant be made by crafters or are real prices to find ( higher material using items ) .

Just my 2 copper .

[Dorganath]

Keeping items in the inventory of pawns will produce lag.  Few of you were around to remember the player merchant NPCs...a place where people could dump items to sell on consignment, even if they weren't around, to other characters.  As cool as the system was, it created a significant amount of lag.

Another option would be simply to reduce the chance of creatures dropping an item, thereby reducing the chance of getting loot that people would find need to pawn.

[LordCove]

Another option would be simply to reduce the chance of creatures dropping an item, thereby reducing the chance of getting loot that people would find need to pawn.

I like this idea actually... even though I know Dorg's kind of teasing with it.

But I'd prefer "craftable" items be removed from the Drops... and not the uncraftables.

Although Im biased a little... it was pretty annoying to find Yew Hunter Longbows dropping from creatures like petty coins. It takes a "lot" of crafting to make this item, and a whole list of hard to get crafting items just to make it ( Dusts of appearance, a dozen sight essences, Clairvoyance... blah blah ).
On one trip we actually found three of them. Three on one run. This item is Yew ( +3, basically Mithril)... and a speciality item to boot.

Of course, I didn't complain when my Mithy Longsword dropped.... which would be equally hard to get the CNR and make for Weaponsmiths... so I'll shut up now.


But yes... remove a certain percentage of "Craftable items" from drops. Make craftable item drops a "rarity".

This free's up all the "junk" people would normally pick up and collect, hence reducing whats sold at the Pawnbrokers, giving Crafters a little more selling power and allowing Pawnbrokers to actually have the coin to buy the "junky uncraftable items" that are found.

[Lynn1020]

I like this idea actually... even though I know Dorg's kind of teasing with it.

But I'd prefer "craftable" items be removed from the Drops... and not the uncraftables.

Although Im biased a little... it was pretty annoying to find Yew Hunter Longbows dropping from creatures like petty coins. It takes a "lot" of crafting to make this item, and a whole list of hard to get crafting items just to make it ( Dusts of appearance, a dozen sight essences, Clairvoyance... blah blah ).
On one trip we actually found three of them. Three on one run. This item is Yew ( +3, basically Mithril)... and a speciality item to boot.

Of course, I didn't complain when my Mithy Longsword dropped.... which would be equally hard to get the CNR and make for Weaponsmiths... so I'll shut up now.


But yes... remove a certain percentage of "Craftable items" from drops. Make craftable item drops a "rarity".

This free's up all the "junk" people would normally pick up and collect, hence reducing whats sold at the Pawnbrokers, giving Crafters a little more selling power and allowing Pawnbrokers to actually have the coin to buy the "junky uncraftable items" that are found.

I completely agree!!  I think all craftable items should be removed.  Jewelry, clothing, weapons etc.

[Stephen_Zuckerman]

I completely agree!!  I think all craftable items should be removed.  Jewelry, clothing, weapons etc.

And replaced with various-stage CNR.

Instead of an Emerald set in a Silver Ring, some emerald dust and maybe a mangled ingot of silver.

Iron longsword? Mangled iron ore.

Scrolls galore? Raw scroll of oak.

Wooden weapons? Shaft of Mahogany wood. Oak sandpaper.

If anything, this would encourage crafters to get together, despite the fact that they'd be picking up more mid-process goods... As those mid-process goods still need to be put together to make something nifty.

[Kirbiana]

One aspect of this discussion that I'd like to bring up is the impact of penniless pawn shops on low-level players who are new to Layonara. When you're just starting out (Levels 1-4) and you want to buy yourself the basic copper armor/weapons at the merchant, I think it would be quite frustrating to find nowhere you can sell your low-level loot for coins.
 
 Is there any chance that the pawn merchants in the starting towns of Hempstead and Vehl could be restricted to buying ONLY from low-level PC's? It might inconvenience the rest of us a little, but we can travel to all those other pawn shops if we want, while folks brand-new to Layo cannot.

[Pen N Popper]

I think Kirbiana has a very valid point.  It is one thing for higher levels to sell things at the pawn shops, that's just the way the game is played.  However, lower level players (and especially Layo newbies) get completely slammed by the need for coins.  Veteran players have an advantage, of course, because they know how the game is played.  I would highly encourage the team to prop up the lower levels more than is apparent now in the MMO.  (eg. A broken pickaxe is just a nuisance to a 10th level; it is a true hardship to a lower level.  The constant mantra of "but it's a gold drain" is weak.)  Perhaps pawn shops should -only- buy things from 9th and lower levels?

[Dorganath]

Restricting them to 9th level and below would make the pawns on Belinara and Dregar generally completely useless, yet they do serve a purpose.  Consider someone above 9th level who got stranded on one of those continents without a boat ticket and not enough gold to buy one.  I know this has happened to several people over the years, and in every one of these cases the character was not of a build that was conducive to soloing the available creatures to swipe a few coins.  But, they just might have a few things in their inventory they could trade for a few coins.

High-level does not equate to "rich" or the ability to obtain gold at any moment just because they know how to play the game.

The real "fix" is changing player behavior.  Mid-to-high level characters who dump all their junk in Port Hempstead and run out the pawns are indeed being inconsiderate to other characters and their players.

[Pen N Popper]

As an entrepreneur, you never never can rely on "changing customer behavior."  If that is in your business plan, rethink it.

The real "fix" is to make the game reward the behavior you want.  The game rewards crafters that sell their makings to pawn shops.  The game rewards looters that sell their loot.  Nothing wrong with that.  However, the lower levels are impacted to a degree that is not pleasant.