For your considerations!

[iceyfire]

Just a thought, i have recently returned from a hiatus due to work reasons its good to see the community still strong , sad to see some old faces missing but there are also plenty of new faces.

Just a thought, there are plenty of NWN communities still playing strong out there, i have look at some and to be honest they lack the overall flair that this one does, however they seem to have more players flocking to them in droves, i ask why is this?

The systems in place for lower levels to rise to a fairly reasonable level to deal with a variety of the dangers present, i believe that the leveling curb may be a bit steep for newer levels, whilst i am aware balance is important, but having excessively high amounts of experience required to level in the early stages seems a bit overwhelming for those just joining the world especialyl when they do not know any other players.

I understand that these higher level thresholds were established to deter players from powerleveling, but in reality it just restricts powerleveling to groups, and it will still happen, overall pushing away from the roleplaying experience. I do not think for a moment that at the higher levels of 15+ that it should change, but i feel that to draw more players you have to give them something they can achieve, and feel as though they are making some kind of headway in the world, especially since not all of us are able to make it to quests at 4am in the morning our time.

Just a little food for thought to start a discussion, im curious to find out what you think?, ultimately its not our vision to tamper with, but im just trying to think of ways we can pull more people into this wonderful community, and retain them.

This is only one way i can think of that doesnt undermine the community with many new powerful characters, but i think it would also help those in the community that have a few powerful characters and would like to try a different concept.

What are your thoughts?

[minerva]

Just a thought, i have recently returned from a hiatus due to work reasons its good to see the community still strong , sad to see some old faces missing but there are also plenty of new faces.
 
 Just a thought, there are plenty of NWN communities still playing strong out there, i have look at some and to be honest they lack the overall flair that this one does, however they seem to have more players flocking to them in droves, i ask why is this?

 
 
 I actually find this interesting and while I appreciate your consideration for not posting other sites here I would be interested if you could send me some links (via PM) to such sites as this is the polar opposite that I have found in my recent seach thru NWN communities.  Perhaps I have been doing my reseach in the wrong areas because I hit a wall of floundering servers with a small core of die hard players within them and very little influx of new blood.
 
 Used to be I could count on 3-4  Private run games a week to join via NWN community but for the past 12 -18 months its lucky if I an find one and that one isn't some teen hack & slash phat loot haul not a true RP experience.
 
 I've used a desk top shortcut to enter layo for ages and have bypassed the server pages via bioware but when I recently entered the "old" way I noticed that what was pages and pages of servers with many password protected realms had significantly decreased and the overall numbers of players was way way down.
 
 My reason for asking is purely marketing research.  I like to poke around and see what works for them, what doesn't.  What kind of player are they attracting and why.  Attracting players in droves sounds good in theory but just what kind of players are they?

[cbnicholson]

During my hiatus a few years ago, I visited a couple of other worlds even dm'd on one of them. I found the two to be filled with players similiar to Layo, but lacking in numbers as well. There were several good game ideas that I really liked, such as having to use torches to burn trolls for good and a coach idea which I've already suggested here, but both had adminstration issues in their governance and ultimately failed. Layo, at least, has a core group that keeps it running  sanely....mostly :p
 
 I've heard rumors of other servers that seem to move quicker relative to server decisions and take player intent and actions more into account, but haven't observed this personally. It sounds great in theory, but it makes me wonder who is making the game balance decisions in those worlds if anyone. *shrugs*
 
 It is my belief that the recent changes in the map with Center have been a huge boon to Layo. Its nice to see characters congregating at the benches for rp at least.  Even if I don't always have the time to stop and chat.  My two true.

[iceyfire]

I will ofcourse Pm those various servers Minerva just give me a chance to do a collation of them.

The main point i am trying to get across is that Layonara is a well crafted server definately the best ive played on, and i feel that it doesnt seem to be getting the recognition it deserves, i have just been pondering why that is...

All that seems to come to mind is that you see many players come and go but the ones that stay seem to be attached to this server in a rather hardcore way, i cant shake that feeling that the overall difficulty in moving up even in the lesser levels 1-15 seems like a huge effort to those casual and those who dont bring along friends to actively level and adventure with.

Makes me wonder if you could lure these players in and retain them by giving them a taste and then continuing business as usual with leveling, so they can atleast feel a little bit powerful for there efforts, and still have that heavy quest/rp focus towards the higher leveling curb.

I hope i am making sense, i am just trying to think back to the feelings i felt when i first started here, and even then i had a lot of help leveling, along with some very close friends that are long gone.

The server has certainly gone leaps and bounds since then i will say, i am just trying to think longterm think towards attracting interest for all things layonara, because more players means more rp, more potential interest for future layonara projects, fresh rp blood, and more exploration of those areas most of us bar a few have not seen.

If players act up the gm's have the policies of the server to fall back on, and obviously keep the character application submissions the way they are to ward off those with no interest in rp whatsoever.

I guess i am just thinking because i hate seeing the server empty at times... i often find myself playing at peak time in Australia alone, or with one or two of us hardcore aussie folk, this server deserves better then that, im just wondering what others think.. the team here does an excellent job, im just doing my part in trying to think of ways to draw more people in to enjoy the experience that is layonara, hope i make sense anyway.

[davidhoff]

Iceyfire, I really appreciate your passion here!  It makes me feel good you are trying to get more folks to Layo and I like to hear upbeat things about the server like the ones you mention.

One thing that I find that helps is to try to plan things in advance and post your outing on the forums and the calandar.  Its gives people a focus and some heads-up to make time in their schedules to be able to play.  It doesn't have to be something big, but the advance notice is the main thing.

Send people tells and reach out "hey what's going on".  This is not something I do much (maybe I'm lazy or its just not my nature *shrugs*), but I'm always pleased when someone sends me a tell to go do something.  It takes a few folks who are "networkers" to get things going sometimes.

Excuse me if I come across as preaching or mommyish, but I wanted to chime in on your post.  Anyways, I like your characters and RP, so feel free to give me a shout if we're ever on together.  Oh and by the way, its great to have you back on the server again...you add alot.

Regards,

Davidhoff

[cbnicholson]

All that seems to come to mind is that you see many players come and go but the ones that stay seem to be attached to this server in a rather hardcore way, i cant shake that feeling that the overall difficulty in moving up even in the lesser levels 1-15 seems like a huge effort to those casual and those who dont bring along friends to actively level and adventure with.
 

 
 I'm not arguing that having friends to adventure with isn't helpful, but I would like to gently point out that xp and leveling may not be the goal you should focus on here. I've long since found that when I don't look for experience points but instead focus on enjoying the game , other players, (ooc and ic) and *gasp* Rp..the levels simply come as a surprise. That said, there are occasions where I get out and push when I have to.
 
 

Iceyfire, I really appreciate your passion here! It makes me feel good you are trying to get more folks to Layo and I like to hear upbeat things about the server like the ones you mention.

repeated deliberately by me as well.

[miltonyorkcastle]

lesser levels 1-15

.... I recall the days when level 14 was considered "high" level.... silly paradigm shifts.... :p

[Stephen_Zuckerman]

.... I recall the days when level 14 was considered "high" level.... silly paradigm shifts.... :p

Yeah, when the 9-12 stretch was supposed to be a nice, tough barrier to the higher levels.

[SteveMaurer]

.... I recall the days when level 14 was considered "high" level.... silly paradigm shifts.... :p

It really is the disparity in level that drives people away.    Being a level 9 in a sea of level 22s is a lonely place to be indeed.   And all but the most hardcore gamers are going to ever get to a level where they can be considered a "peer", where ones PC efforts aren't considered paltry in comparison to the PCs of people who play obsessively.

Most don't want to put in the effort, so they drop away.

I have to say that things like the gnome quest are an excellent way to combat this tendency, but that is highly dependent on having a dedicated, talented, GM.

Layo is one of the few servers that still reports relative power levels between players on a right-click.   Other servers have code that disables this (which makes sizing up enemies a bit more hazardous as well).

[morunas]

Interesting thread ^^

Well I guess this is being in comparison with only RP servers right? -_-'

I have played (and still play), on a certain NWN action server for now over 9 years (and I'm 22 yo so you can see how deep it goes). The server is simply amazing although it faced the action servers problem which is "you only grow upwards" and not "shift sides" like you do in RP. Still the server as of late had a media of 10-20 players online daily. But it has lacked of backend support... and that is something that players don't see but feel. When the world has no big changes for long and routines become more and more heavy to follow, even if partying with really great folks, in the limit... it dies.

This lack of backend - cause any player with certain characteristics can be a frontend GMs... but few can be backend GMs... right? - is something I fear to be a very delicate issue that as far as I know Layo has not faced at all! So keep it up and don't loose those barricades!

BUT even more important then that... like any product in any market there is a life cycle... and NWN1 in my opinion is at a very extended decline phase.

Newer generations (and I know this looking to all the friends I have that like games in general) search for better graphics... better game dynamics... and above all... to play the games that "are the fashion" so to speak. So they can be able to talk at school/university/friends/wtv about the recent game plays.

I know lot of players who simply left NWN and not they've traded it for similar newer games... they just grew out of it... perhaps now they play PES/FIFA, or have entered Aion, WoW, Lineage, whatever those are... perhaps they don't play computer games anymore and just want to watch movies. And I haven't seen any charts but my feeling, and of course this is an obvious, indeed sad, tendency, NWN players will not increase, only decrease.

Perhaps Layo as is can still assimilate players from other dieing servers, like a giant eating small companies in the brink of extinction... but even the giant will die of age.

And for this... I give by best luck wishes to the Layo MMO which, if it maintains Layo spirit, will be a great success on holding to players.

And I might just drop here my opinion... although Layo was made with some professionalism... that will not guarantee AT ALL (just my feeling!) that these players will stick around the same producers just cause they made a new game. If the learning curve fails... if the environment feels different/unfamiliar... if the very "common plebe" disperses... it might easily fail - from keeping the old ones, not from attracting new folks .

For instance, and I'll be blunt - do remove the post if this is inappropriate O.o - I gave just a little glimpse on the Rune game, out of mere curiosity, and soon lost the appetite to see more. Perhaps I lost an opportunity for a great experience... perhaps I didn't... I knew the people who made it made a great Job with Layo... but that doesn't sell the fish (at least for me ).

And sincerely, wish all this team the best of success.

[cbnicholson]

Send people tells and reach out "hey what's going on".

 I'm a fan of doing this when there aren't many players on myself.  I think most people would be amazed at interest in 'grouping up' if you just take the time to ask.