Oh Well

[Nomsat]

That didnt take too long ~

Sorry, but I am afraid this server is not for me.  I played for 2 of my 4 precious playing hours and only made 2 levels.  The first guy I came across either a) didnt understand english or b) doesnt like to help newbs.  He wouldnt answer any of my questions and when I told him I was new to the server his response was

 *shrugs*
relevance?


needless to say..I just turned around and ran off the screen.

I went out the main gate and took a left at the first turn and zoned.  I went down that road to a barn and took the right turn.  I followed it off the screen and zoned.  I came to a zone with a hill on the left, a hill on the right, and a path going between them.  On the right hill was a skunk.  I "conned" him and it said he was overpowering.  So I started up the hill on the left with the intention of going around the skunk on the right hill.  When I got to the top of the hill a freaking GRIFFON attacked me.  I made it back to the zone and actually made it through the zone with a sliver of life left.  When I came through the zone..the griffon was waiting on me and *gobble* ...he snacked on Dwarf ~  My first death.

I respawned and was out looking around again when I had a kobold spawn on me.  Now even a first level fighter should be able to kill 3 kobolds and not lose half of his hitpoints unless he is having terrible rolls.... but this wasnt a real kobold.  This was a hill giant polymorphed into a kobold skin.  I did lots of damage and the dang thing didnt die...but I did!  My second death.
As I sat there cussing at the sceen a person happens to run by and aggros the kobold/giant.  It does a lot of damage to her but she kills it.  Then she rezzes me!!!  Woot!  a Cleric!
So I role play with her for 20 minutes and she finally decides to help me out with a quest to get a magic branch from some kobolds.  She tells me /ooc she is 7th level and answers lots of my questions.  Her name was Iz.  It was actually much longer than that ...something like IzthisnamelongenoughgeeIdontthinkso.  I dunno...she said to call her Iz ~

So after 20 minutes of roleplaying "preparing" for the combat we go to the next zone and aggro 2 hill giants and a fire giant.  Oops..I mean 3 kobolds.  Long story short ... I die again.  She rezzes me.  She suggests I quit dieing.  I tell her I'll think about it ~

Anyhow, those 3 didnt have the magic stick.  She said we needed to hit their camp for the magic stick.

Away we go ....

More role playing to get ready and then we pounce on the sentry.  Ok..I am doing better... I actually survive a fight.... and LVL!  Woohoo!  Hitpoints! and Cleave!

So we move around to take a 3 spawn.  She takes out two while I "distract" the third one.  Me and this 3rd one have a real tough fight.  It is Ray Charles vs Stevie Wonder.  I am watching the numbers go scrolling by on my screen.  I have never seen so many 1's 2's or 3's before.  *whiff* *whiff* *whiff*  *whiff* *whiff* *whiff* *whiff* *whiff* *whiff* *whiff* *whiff* *whiff* *whiff* *whiff* *whiff* *HIT* OMG!  a hit.  Meanwhile, Iz has both of hers killed, looted, sharpened her sword, polished her armor, taken a nap, has made a sandwich, and is sitting under a shade tree watching.  I finally kill it and we move to the next spawn.  I think I died again there...cant remember now....(death does that to ya ~)

Finally, we kill the right guy and get the magic stick.  We do a full military withdrawal to the exit (which is to say we tucked our armored skirts up and ran like little girls).

She tells me go ahead and talk to the Captain and that she has to go.  /gasp NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO.

My Guardian Angel!  NOooooooo.  /sob

Oh well, I do the turn in and level!  Yay! More hitpoints and Dodge!  I also got a bag that I cant use until level 5.  Wheee.

So I go back out and run around looking for something a 3rd level fighting can kill.  Maybe a cricket or a grasshopper.
I run around and find an Ogre.  I think to myself …holy !  An Ogre!  After fighting killer kobolds I am picturing an M1A1 Abrams tank in front of me.  To my amazement this was an actual Ogre.  I kill it.  Ok…now I am feeling more Dwarfly.  Maybe those kobolds weren’t too bad… maybe my rolls were just terrible.

I run into a bard and we group up.  He says he will show me around after we role play for 10 minutes or so.  We go through some zones and he is showing me around and suddenly we come across a lone archer kobold.  It’s just one little kobold right?  Wrong.  This one is a polymorphed Red dragon.  This stupid archer kobold kills us each 4 times.  I decide right then and there that this server isn’t for me.

For Iz and the bard who tried to help me … Thank you very much !
To the rest of you…good luck with your polymorphed monsters.

/salute

[MJZ]

I have to say most of this is familiar to myself, and probably anyone else who has played on this server. Eh heh..

You know, I think the idea behind the difficulty is for people to form up groups in order to take down monsters,get immersed in RP, get to know one another, make full use of a variety of skills, and to discourage solo-ing, probably most importantly.

But a few things here do ring true.

It was actually much longer than that ...something like IzthisnamelongenoughgeeIdontthinkso.

Eh hehehe... finally someone who shares my pain.

To the rest of you...good luck with your polymorphed monsters.

And thanks. We're going to need it.

[Kindo]

Wow... Very interesting post here. It is true that Layonara has a quite high difficulty level. Mostly all monsters you come by have tweaked attributes and damage. This is all to promote partying up and to travel in groups, however. Even the starting quest-areas are really tough if you're on your own. Yes, even a fighter has a hard time surviving the sewer rats in Hempstead, which is another starting quest. Basically, you stand little chance surviving anywhere if you are on your own, and you should advisably have at least one or two other friends with you. Even then, it can be difficult (as your example above proves).

In any case, the difficulty of the server is intentional, but I suppose it would be a good idea to have these things explained to you either upon logging on for the first time, or have a kind of "welcome"-letter sent to you when your first character is approved, with some basic suggestions on where to go and how you should play in a group rather than to go out on your own.

"Welcome to Layonara! Good starting areas for new characters are the sewers in Port Hempstead, or the Kobolds outside town. Keep in mind, however, that you stand little chance of surviving either encounter if you are on your own. Our advice to you is to start familiarizing yourself with the city and its inhabitants a bit, in order to find friends who can help you with these quests."

Short and simple like that. Then again, there are not always people around to talk to or ask for help. I wish you wouldn't give up so soon, though. Give it another chance, take some time to get into the quite special atmosphere of Layonara, and perhaps you will start appreciating it more eventually. It's a slow-pace server, but it houses some of the finest role-players out there.

[MJZ]

...and you should advisably have at least one or two other friends with you.

..More like four or five, and even then..

[Nomsat]

all right.  Will give it another try after receiving a flood of emails.

Thanks.

[ycleption]

Someone in another post mentioned the difficulty of finding the quest in the sewers, which is really the only area a lvl 1 (or a group of level 1s) has a chance of soloing. . . I think this post drives that home. It should be possible for a new player to at least kill a few things without a much higher level patron.

[orth]

Changes to the new player's ventures were in the works before this post.  We did realize a gap in that regard and it will be corrected.

The bug of respawning near Hlint also causes some headaches.

[Nibor21]

As Orth says we have lots in the works right now. and are trying to fix all these issues.

However we do need a little patience. I work with a great team of people who all give of their time freely. They don't ask for any rewards, which is lucky because they don't get any. But as we are volunteers we can only spend so much time fixing things and adding to the world.

It also takes longer to add things than many of you would guess. Bioware never designed NWN for persistent worlds. Single-player and multi-player games yes, persistent worlds no. What the community at large and the the layo team specifically have done is awesome. They have taken  a good and stretched it far beyond its original target. V3 was a huge release and we are still trying to deal with the fallout from that. but we will.

In addition we actually like to play on Layo in some of our spare time as well as just fix code etc. So please give us some time. We will get there.

[Hellblazer]

Nomsat, reading your post I would stay stick with it, first you seem like a fun guy or girl to hang around with, you made me laugh a lot reading your post. Second as many mentioned this is made to promote grouping of multitude of players and different skills. With time things will get easier as you will find good people to party with, and the little issues will be fixed too.

Keep you chin up and you'll get there.

[darkstorme]

*chuckles*  I remember when Kell died facing off against weak goblins... even the rats could take him, in groups.  This is a slow-progression server, but it's a heck of a lot of fun.

If you're in it to hit level 20 in a month, looking elsewhere is your best bet, but if you want to be a part of the best server online, stick around.

Edit: Also, while I realize it might seem a bit unfair to create "wolves in sheep's clothing" as it were by tweaking goblins and kobolds to be a challenge to an eighth or twelfth level fighter, consider that there are over two thousand areas in Layonara... and significantly fewer monsters to select from.  And you don't want characters getting inured to massive armoured constructs teamed up with ancient red dragons.

[jrizz]

In any case, the difficulty of the server is intentional, but I suppose it would be a good idea to have these things explained to you either upon logging on for the first time, or have a kind of "welcome"-letter sent to you when your first character is approved, with some basic suggestions on where to go and how you should play in a group rather than to go out on your own.

"Welcome to Layonara! Good starting areas for new characters are the sewers in Port Hempstead, or the Kobolds outside town. Keep in mind, however, that you stand little chance of surviving either encounter if you are on your own. Our advice to you is to start familiarizing yourself with the city and its inhabitants a bit, in order to find friends who can help you with these quests."

Great idea thanks, I have copied your text and will use it when approving new PCs for new players.

[Honora]

Just a quick note; if you use the above notice for new players, be sure to add a blurb for Fort Vehl as well, since some might start there .

[jrizz]

"Welcome to Layonara! Good starting areas for new characters are the sewers in Port Hempstead, the Kobolds outside Port Hempstead, and the crypts in Fort Vehl. Keep in mind, however, that you stand little chance of surviving these encounters if you are on your own. Our advice to you is to start familiarizing yourself with these two citys and their inhabitants a bit, in order to find friends who can help you with these quests."

[Interia_Discordius]

Just a note...I'm almost always online as Kinai Kinsei, so if you ever want to have a little hand in helping, seek her out She's a nice one, she'd do a bit for you or point you in the right direction for some such.

[Kindo]

Great idea thanks, I have copied your text and will use it when approving new PCs for new players.

Oh, go ahead. It was just a bit of an example, which can be polished and tweaked a bit. Also, add something about Vehl like Honora said. In any case, I think it's a good idea to tell something like that to all new players, and I'm glad you agree and will put it into action.

[Lilswanwillow]

and there are a FEW of us that will help...
when I'm on, I have Beilidel, shes usually lazing around Hempstead or Stormcrest crossroads, or, well, just lazing around.

there ARE others, you just have to take it in stride.  It sounds like the first one you met is fully immersed in RP and RP'ing his/her char as a mean-dirty-rotten... was it Hawklen? (lol)

But shes always in for a fun go-through of the newbie level areas!! they are challenging for her, and shes level 9...

[Interia_Discordius]

Hey now, don't make fun of Hawklen. That's Kinai's man!

[kuchida]

Well, I have some thoughts that are sure to be controversial..

With the changes to v3 I think it is much more difficult for brand new players. Not veterans starting new characters, but people who have never been here before. I think there should be more (and I know this is can be a dirty word here) "solo-able" quests for new arrivals to acclimate themselves. More letters to deliver (and from the starting areas, not Krandor!), more weak monsters to clear in tiny dungeons in the city, something.  Or CNR to gather to introduce them to the craft system, like find cotton, silk, barley, etc. Nothing too difficult, but not too rewarding either- Maybe just offer a stack of healing potions as a reward, etc. I understand that partying is encouraged but it is not like there won't be plenty of time for that later (and really if you only solo you won't end up getting anywhere on this world anyway; even the mid-level quests like the horse oil make that pretty clear and are great ways to bring people together, and being antisocial simply is not fun here in the end)

Keep in mind it's not always possible to even find help. If you plop down in Hempstead or Vehl there is quite often no one there. Or one level 20 guy on the bench who may be AFK. When it was Hlint, you started out in the middle of a busy town and it was quite difficult NOT to run into various people passing back and forth, often who would stop to offer help when they saw you in the stupid looking beginner leather armor. Now you can often wander through Hempstead for a half hour without seeing another soul.  Yes, if you wait long enough and talk to a few people you will eventually find help.. But what is the incentive to do that?  If I knew nothing about the server and this happened to me I'd probably just leave without a second thought. How about giving a new player a lot of easy to find "busywork" to do in the meantime?  Especially if they are the only extremely low level person on the server, which if you look at the server status page is often the case?  

I say these things because I am afraid the community is growing smaller.  It does seem more difficult to find a group than it used to, partly because things are more spread out, partly because the game itself is getting older and new people just aren't showing up to replace the older people who drift away. A couple of times I've been on late in the evening and I've been literally the only one here!  We should be encouraging new people to come and play and stay as much as we can, which means giving them a very clear path of jobs and tasks to get them from 1st to 3rd or 4th level which will also introduce them to the world. Giving them a purpose (like a city or CNR to find, etc.) also makes it easier to strike up a conversation  with an older player, instead of asking them to just go up and start role-playing (which, speaking for myself, is really hard to do "cold"- just like I would never walk up to stranger in the mall and start up a conversation unless I needed directions.)

[Black Raven]

So you're the dwarf Iz met the other day? heh just so you know, her name was supposed to be a pain on purpose, even I cant spell it

But anyway, I'm really sad to hear you didnt like the server, from what I've seen from meeting you you were a great roleplayer and were quite fun and amusing to hang with! Sadly I couldnt stay otherwise I would have helped you some more and show you the rest of the beautiful areas you should and shouldnt go through(That I know off anyway).

I have to say though, first from reading through your post I felt as if I was acting wrong too, which I hope I havent and if I did, my apologies. Her comment on how you shouldnt die alot wasnt ment to insult you oocly in any way, she was just acting "paladinishly", you know....feeling all mighty and superior that thinks she can tell others how to behave, was in no way ment to oocly offend you!.

And one last thing, Iz isn't a cleric, she just used lay on hands on you twice which I didnt know actualy gives exp when saving people so it was a win-win situation for the both of us, heh.

Again, hope you stay and try the server again cause I can really see you fit here with your roleplaying (you sneaking in a "dwarf way" still makes me chuckle heh), just dont mind the levels much

[Tanman]

Or CNR to gather to introduce them to the craft system, like find cotton, silk, barley, etc.

There are  places where you can pick up two of the three easily. *Winks*
Won't say where though!