Understanding Weird and Wail of the Banshee

[merlin34baseball]

Tyrian tends to light everything she can find on fire....  never heard anyone complain.

So If you scare some one to death its bad?

If you cause them massive brain hemorages it bad?

Tyrian is leaving charred corpses in her wake..... which no one seems to mind.

She's been napalming Layo for a year and a half...

Which is worse and in whose judgement?

*wait .... as far as the complaining part at the beginning, she's heard plenty from singed fighters and companions*

[darby snails]

No really, as many players layo have, almost as many ways there is to interpret the spells.

Nothing is 100 percent right or wrong. Some people/player care about the spells some dont and thats what makes it such a good topic IC.

A topic that can be discussed for eternity on layo and best IC!

The only problem is we aren't given a lot of explanation for some spells, especially the more complex and wild ones, which is where this confusion arises.  It's hard to have a good discussion when all we have to go on is a brief description and an animation.  In cases like this of course, not for simple spells like Magic Missle.  

I'd love to see in future Layo handbooks more detailed descriptions of exactly what spells do..  And even better, a background history of some of the wilder ones.  I would think a lot of them would be named after the wizard who invented them, and might have a great story behind them..  Of course it would be even better if PC wizards were allowed to experiment with spellcrafting themselves and invent new ones (and more often than not fail miserably) that could become part of the game, but that's probably not too possible..!

[Skywatcher]

Well this has been a great discussion on these two spells.  I apreciate everyone's inputs.   This will change the way I RP responding to these and other spells.

[lonnarin]

If you think that's bad, try explaining spell resistance vs. conjuration.  Now nobody would consider that a summoned creature biting somebody with spell resistance up would be interfered with... the animal is physically there and its bite is not a spell ability to be blocked.  However, how then do people with spell resistance get the chance to negate physical fireballs, lightning bolts and acid arrows heading thir way?  Sure the fire, electricity and acid is there because of magic, but after the initial instance of summoning, one would think that the fire is now a natural and physical occurance.  if anything, the fire should have dissipated at the very point of magical creation and fizzled instead of being shot, but what we get is a big fireball which fizzles on the SR warded folks while it is still burning the unwarded people beside them.  Another of my long list of beefs with the d20 system, heheh.

Back on topic, I don't know if this is a bug or not, but the Skald ability that mimics Wail of the Banshee called "Broken Wail" seems to be a purely psychological and un-supernatural ability.  It requires a Fort Save vs. Death and is based on the skald's level and charisma bonus, but seems not to be subject to either Spell Resistance or Spell Immunity.  We found this out when Farros and Skabot were in the arena and he had his Shadow Shield and Spell Resistance up.... the Wail cut right through both like putty.  Now I understand that the Broken Wail is technically not a spell nor necromancy, so it shouldn't be blocked on either of those two levels, but the Shadow Shield still had "Immunity: Death Attacks" which I assumed the Broken Wail was.  We checked it some more and Death Ward didn't work against it as well.  Is this a bug or not?  By my understanding, if it is not a bug, then the Broken Wail must be some horridly wretched song that affects the target on a natural level, causing them to die of broken morale; ie: literally draining the will to live.  If the broken wail is somehow supernatural though, I think the Death Ward and Shadowshield *should* be blocking it, since instant death magical/supernatural-abilities like Bodak Gazes and some of the nastier Undead attacks do indeed seem to be blocked by these.  I did note that Undead are still immune to the wail, so I'm not entirely certain though why undead immunity to instant death is different from the immunites bestowed by Deathward and Shadowshield though.

[darkstorme]

If you think that's bad, try explaining spell resistance vs. conjuration.  Now nobody would consider that a summoned creature biting somebody with spell resistance up would be interfered with... the animal is physically there and its bite is not a spell ability to be blocked.  However, how then do people with spell resistance get the chance to negate physical fireballs, lightning bolts and acid arrows heading thir way?  Sure the fire, electricity and acid is there because of magic, but after the initial instance of summoning, one would think that the fire is now a natural and physical occurance.  if anything, the fire should have dissipated at the very point of magical creation and fizzled instead of being shot, but what we get is a big fireball which fizzles on the SR warded folks while it is still burning the unwarded people beside them.  Another of my long list of beefs with the d20 system, heheh.

Well, with both the fireball and the lightning bolt, I think SR can reasonably be explained.  For the fireball, a dot of fire rushes across the intervening distance between caster and target and then bursts into an explosion of flame, dealing tremendous damage - more than non-magical fire can do.  The fire isn't fueled by anything physical - it's fed by magic.  So some sort of magic field must be set up in the blast radius.. and it is that field that SR negates, causing the blast to flicker out before it hits our successfully resisting individual.  A lightning bolt flung from a wizard's hand, left to its own devices, would likely ground out to the nearest opportunity.  So a magic force is creating and maintaining a stream of positive ions, a channel along which the lightning bolt can travel.  That force, again, can be negated by the SR of the individual against whom it's targeted.

Then again, we could just say "it's magic", and leave it at that.  It is, after all, a fantasy game.

[lonnarin]

But your magi-scientific explaination is so much better!

That is very true... a fireball sailing through the air would, if left to its own devices, dissipate as it had nothing physical to fuel it other than thin air, and a natural electric charge coming from a wizard would most certainly ground itself in the closest guy wearing or holding metal.

[LynnJuniper]

*shakes her head*

No no No!

The proper way of explaining it is as follows:

A Wizard/Sorcerer did it...

And then walk off nodding sagely.

You have much to learn.

[Dorganath]

*shakes her head*

No no No!

The proper way of explaining it is as follows:

A Wizard/Sorcerer did it...

And then walk off nodding sagely.

You have much to learn.

VILE NECROMANCER!!! *shakes a fist*

[twidget658]

Well this has been a great discussion on these two spells. I apreciate everyone's inputs. This will change the way I RP responding to these and other spells.

 
 I agree. Many thanks! Puts a whole new spin on things.