Author Topic: A Questions about Multiclassing Monks and Fighter (Read 1392 times)

ShiffDrgnhrt · « **on:** February 04, 2007, 03:43:07 PM »

Ok, Before you tell me about the Disciplined Lives of monks and straying from that path is a No-No and your not allowed back in, Read ALL this Thread.... PLEASE.

OK, to start, we all know a monk is an individual who has dedicated their lives to the perfection of there body and the art of unarmed combat. OK, thats great for Monks.

Now Fighters, we all know, Dedicate themselves to the art of war, and those who become Weapon Masters they become dedicated to becoming the master of ONE specific Weapon...

SO! WHY in the world could a Monk NOT be allowed to not only dedicate himself to the perfection of his mind and body, but also dedicate himself to the perfection of fighting with his body.

We have all heard at one point or another of the Shaolin Monks, who dedicate there lives to the philosophies of Buddha, and to the perfection of mind and body through the martial arts of Shaolin, Tai Chi, Pa Kua, and a myraid of other Mind-and-Body martial arts. We have also all heard of the Samurai, who despite being highly trained warriors with seemingly no other redeemable facets, The Ideal Samurai was also a philosopher and poet, and most often a learned man. Now the two have obvious differences, A Shaolin monk is obviously more balanced between philosophy and martial skill, and a Samurai is much more of a warrior in most chases.

Now to the reason for this Thread. I want to know if I could make, FROM CHAR APproval, a Monk Fighter/Fighter Monk. I understand rules and such, but i think I make a good argument for my case. Now, I am willing to put restrictions on this sort of arrangement. I know Monks are limited in the Weapons they can use, so I would not expand it, and if i wanted to it would be to exotic weapons (katana, shuriken, kama) that a Monk/Samurai would have used. At the same time, I would also take a limited number of fighter classes, probably 5-8 in order to only added some of the fighting skill to the Monk. I would RP him as being a monk entirely, being a very defense oriented person, not one seeking to go "hunting" all the time. Now, I'm sure your all thinking NO!, but give it some thought. And don't just respond with "NO, Monks cant Multiclass like that." I'd like some serious discussion about it if I am to let this drop. Thank you

Stephen_Zuckerman · « **Reply #1 on:** February 04, 2007, 03:55:03 PM »

I understand your argument, but... I only have two things to say.

First, the ONLY reason to split Monk and Fighter level is to get a higher AB, and that still hurts you in the long run, because you lose out on quicker access to the Monk abilities.

Second, the Team cannot make exceptions, because they have to treat everyone the same way to keep things fair. If they make an exception for one person, they have to make it for everyone. I can make a wonderful case for why Grok should have Scent, but he's not going to if he doesn't go Bear Warrior.

ShiffDrgnhrt · « **Reply #2 on:** February 04, 2007, 03:56:29 PM »

Well... I understand that, but I want to hear what the team would say....

Witch Hunter · « **Reply #3 on:** February 04, 2007, 03:56:54 PM »

Frankly I think it's more of a balance issue rather than RP reasons, although I could name a few (vows being one).

A monk multiclass is very strong, infact, pretty much divine at high levels... you'd get rather corny multiclassing if you allow it :p and powergaming is already an issue with whats allowed.

ShiffDrgnhrt · « **Reply #4 on:** February 04, 2007, 03:58:36 PM »

Wait, how is multiclassin a Monk potentially powergamin or divine?

Witch Hunter · « **Reply #5 on:** February 04, 2007, 04:02:58 PM »

Wisdom bonus to Ac to begin with, monk speed, immunities, spellresistance and so forth.
Back when NWN just came out every person on a PVP server had 1 monk level at least just for the wisdom bonus...

Plus it doesnt make sense that a monk would be able to master himself and achive what he does (immunities, resistance and so forth) if he dedicates himself to another path as well... and the fact you take levels in another class only delay it a bit.. he shouldn't be able to achive them at all.

ShiffDrgnhrt · « **Reply #6 on:** February 04, 2007, 04:06:10 PM »

So a Monk is basically Strong all by itself?

Cause I come up with these ideas not to make the ultimate warrior, but more to make an interesting Character.

Stephen_Zuckerman · « **Reply #7 on:** February 04, 2007, 04:07:42 PM »

A monk is stupendously strong, single-classed. At low levels, the AC is rough, but as it creeps ahead, the character's overall power gets INSANE.

Remember that you'd have to RP a lawful alignment, though.

ShiffDrgnhrt · « **Reply #8 on:** February 04, 2007, 04:08:35 PM »

Thats not hard fer me the alignment part. I live that life to begin with. I actually had a really interesting Idea of what he'd be like too

He wasnt even gonna be able to speak common

Stephen_Zuckerman · « **Reply #9 on:** February 04, 2007, 04:14:23 PM »

Then why not just make a straight monk, or an Unarmed WM?

Witch Hunter · « **Reply #10 on:** February 04, 2007, 04:17:49 PM »

you can have an unarmed weaponmaster? maybe a cleric/weaponmaster/sacred fist :O

Stephen_Zuckerman · « **Reply #11 on:** February 04, 2007, 04:18:27 PM »

Nice, Witch Hunter.

ShiffDrgnhrt · « **Reply #12 on:** February 04, 2007, 04:21:34 PM »

because I wouldnt feel that he is really the pious monk I'm aiming for. And you can't say that in their Prime, the Shaolin monks were not Excellent warriors as well. They used the skills of MArtial arts to bring to themselves both strength, discipline, and spiritual one ness. Tai Chi and Pa Kua are in essence MArtial arts and can be used in combat, but they are more for focusig energy and healing. Tai Chi, although meaning Supreme Ultimate Fist, is used in modern medicine to promote health and longevity. I myself practice Shaolin and there is MUCH more to it then being able to break bricks and jump through the air. If you mind and body are not disciplined the training is useless.

If fact that is step one in becoming disciplined. Shaolin focuses on strength, but once you master it and begin to learn the arts of Tai Chi, you begin to gain the mental and spiritual power that truly makese Kung Fu Deadly.

Dorganath · « **Reply #13 on:** February 04, 2007, 04:26:40 PM »

You can have a multi-classed monk character, but if you start with monk and take other levels, you cannot take additional monk levels. If you start with some other class and move to Monk, then you cannot take any more levels in the first class, or else you will forfeit your right to continue to take levels as a monk.
A monk's benefits come from dedicating his life to that path. If he ever leaves that path, he cannot progress along that path any longer.
I think it's pretty clearly spelled out here.
It's a balance issue.
It's a power-build issue.
It's a D&D 3rd edition rule (upon which NWN is based).
It's a "Leanthar does not want it to be any other way" issue.
I'm kind of confused by this:

Quote

WHY in the world could a Monk NOT be allowed to not only dedicate himself to the perfection of his mind and body, but also dedicate himself to the perfection of fighting with his body.

A high-level monk does fight with his body, and quite effectively at that. At some point, his effectiveness when unarmed surpasses his effectiveness when armed.

ShiffDrgnhrt · « **Reply #14 on:** February 04, 2007, 04:33:06 PM »

Well thats the answer i was aimin to get. Ok, I think i got the idea, but have one last question... A CDQ is necessary to go FROM To monk, right? And im guessingya have to be a certain lvl AND have the CDT for it. Right?

Polak76 · « **Reply #15 on:** February 04, 2007, 04:35:48 PM »

By the way, you can't make an unarmed weaponsmaster. That is unless something has changed I'm unaware of.

Weaponsmasters must be proficient with a melee weapon (fists not included).

Dorganath · « **Reply #16 on:** February 04, 2007, 04:37:18 PM »

The same rules apply for all multiclassing and CDQs, in terms of levels. Since monk is not a PrC, you probably need to wait until level 10.

ShiffDrgnhrt · « **Reply #17 on:** February 04, 2007, 04:38:08 PM »

OK, then I guess I'm done here. Thank you

Talan Va'lash · « **Reply #18 on:** February 04, 2007, 11:12:47 PM »

Quote

Polak76 - 2/4/2007 5:35 PM

By the way, you can't make an unarmed weaponsmaster. That is unless something has changed I'm unaware of.

Weaponsmasters must be proficient with a melee weapon (fists not included).

No, a weapon master must have the feat Weapon Focus in a melee weapon.

No idea if NWN counts fists as a "melee weapon" or if you could take WM in unarmed strike if you burnt a feat on Weap. Foc. in longsword or something.

However, you sure could be a Kama weaponmaster.

Stephen_Zuckerman · « **Reply #19 on:** February 04, 2007, 11:22:50 PM »

You can't get Weapon Focus [Unarmed Strike]?