Author Topic: RP a kidnapping? (Read 626 times)

Wraithdur · « **on:** August 20, 2006, 02:06:01 pm »

i have been thinking about this for some time, is it possible to RP a kidnapping?
i have heard mention of kidnap here and there, but just mention.
if so how (do you send the person you are going to kidnap a tell saying "i'm kidnapping you")
i understand that only certain alignments would do this (not shure EXACTLY which ones)

darkstorme · « **Reply #1 on:** August 21, 2006, 08:21:03 am »

Well, really, the tell would have to be "I'm going to try to kidnap you." They would then roll the appropriate dice, and the would-be-kidnapper could wind up on the ground with a knee poised over his trachea.

The only way a kidnapping will go off without a hitch is if it is plot-convenient - that is, if a GM is running it. If you wanted to RP a kidnapping, you could perhaps set it up with a character beforehand, but you certainly couldn't kidnap a random individual without significant prior discussion, or the return tell will simply be "no, you're not." Also, what would be the purpose of a kidnapping? Ransom? While there are people with significant others on Layo, most do not have them, and would be disinclined to pay... and furthermore, I'm fairly sure the server rules would require the confiscation of any money thus obtained.

Stephen_Zuckerman · « **Reply #2 on:** August 21, 2006, 04:43:33 pm »

Hey, I'd personally be up for a few dicerolls regarding a kidnapping attempt, but there are times when it's just not convenient. If someone tried kidnapping Tyeaan, for example, they'd roll a STR check, I'd roll DEX (because there's no Escape Artist skill in NWN), and if I failed that, Tyeaan would start trying to cast. Another STR on your part, with Concentration to oppose it. I succeed, I get to cast a spell. I fail, and, well, I get carted off.

With Pyyran... There's not much point in even trying unless you're either massively stronger than him, a ridiculously high level, or both, because he has this annoying tendancy to kill himself to make his way back to the Bindstone.

The way this would work, before the rolls even started, would be that you'd send me a Tell, asking me if I wanted to play it out. The answer would usually be yes, but you should ALWAYS ask.

The difference between an RP stalker and griefing is the OOC relations.

darkwulf365 · « **Reply #3 on:** August 21, 2006, 05:10:35 pm »

Quote

Stephen_Zuckerman - 8/21/2006 7:43 PM
With Pyyran... There's not much point in even trying unless you're either massively stronger than him, a ridiculously high level, or both, because he has this annoying tendancy to kill himself to make his way back to the Bindstone.

This is a very bad habit, and I find it disappointing that anybody who would was desireable to be kidnapped would resort to such a tactic to escape.

Despite the fact that you're trusting your soul to an ancient magic that has always worked in the past but may not *always* work.

Stephen_Zuckerman · « **Reply #4 on:** August 21, 2006, 05:33:04 pm »

Desirable to be kidnapped? Well, Pyyran's not that, but... As to it not always working, Pyyran has no reason to expect it won't work. The most he fears in that instance is losing another piece of his soul, which is SOMETIMES an acceptable risk (like when reality is crumbling around you). None of my other three characters would willingly do such a thing, but then, they're a bit more well-balanced than Pyyran.

The idea of playing out a kidnapping sounds great, though. The question you don't really consider before it actually starts rolling, is what would your character do in the situation? Is escape worth whatever means they'd have to go to, etc....

Sounds like fun RP to me.

Leanthar · « **Reply #5 on:** August 21, 2006, 05:59:21 pm »

"...With Pyyran... There's not much point in even trying unless you're either massively stronger than him, a ridiculously high level, or both, because he has this annoying tendancy to kill himself to make his way back to the Bindstone...."
Stephen, that is NOT RP'ing... That is using a system to escape the end result and it is not a good idea. I am disappointed that you even think that is acceptable RP.

Stephen_Zuckerman · « **Reply #6 on:** August 21, 2006, 06:05:42 pm »

I suppose I misunderstand just what the Bindstones mean to the Dragoncalled and... Whatever the new ones are called. Can I get a bit of clarification? All I've really gathered to this point is that they are some sort of ancient device that whisks you away just after death, and brings you back, taking its toll on your body, mind, and pocketbook. Is there anything to give an adventurer the idea that they wouldn't do exactly that? I'm genuinely a little confused as to how things work with the Bindstones (according to the perspective of most characters, at least), if there's no way for a character to come to the conclusion that that might be a usable strategy in a dire enough circumstance.

Leanthar · « **Reply #7 on:** August 21, 2006, 07:26:50 pm »

So, let me get this straight... You, playing Pyyran... Think it is okay for Pyyran (the character that you are RP'ing) to get himself KILLED so that you can use the bindstone system to escape? Please tell me you don't think that is okay.

Etinfall · « **Reply #8 on:** August 21, 2006, 07:34:02 pm »

Kidnapping, huh? I bet it comes down to coordination with other players, even a DM if possible. You would of course have to plan it out. Can't just say, "I walk up to Brisbane and kidnapp her. She would wallop me to the ground. As would most characters. But if you plan it out, let her know(OOC), and have a DM there to help with the proper rolls(I wouldn't know what to use), I am sure you can try.
Goodluck...errr, wait a minute. No good luck!!!

Etinfall

I have always thought of bindstones as an ooc game mechanic to help us play longer. The stories around it are there to hide it from our ooc eyes. To use the mechanism to escape death(or a situation-(edit here)) seems wrong. On the rp side, I have always taken dieing very seriously. Even though I might not lose a soul strand, I usually rp it that way, or worse.

Stephen_Zuckerman · « **Reply #9 on:** August 21, 2006, 07:37:38 pm »

Not in any sort of normal circumstance, no; vitually always, the more-or-less temporary anguish of death and being pulled back from it, combined with the risk of losing a part of his soul, is a much worse option than anything else. However, if, for example, he was on a demiplane of some sort, which was collapsing around him, and there was no other escape... I can't understand why he wouldn't at least give it a shot. A complete unknown, set against a set of consequences he knows all too well... The choice for Pyyran, at least to me, is obvious. (Not that his attempt actually worked when he was in the situation I used as an example - his body wouldn't respond to what he wanted it to do because of the magic holding him in place.)

For myself... I always thought the Bindstones were an IC system. Are they not? That might clear up a few things.

As a sidenote, the way Pyyran has seen the Bindstones, it's not really death unless you don't come back.

So... If my (and Pyyran's) ideas about the Bindstones are just totally in the wrong ballpark, I'll make changes accordingly.

regnus · « **Reply #10 on:** August 21, 2006, 07:45:03 pm »

Stephen

How can you possibly think that suicide is something that should EVER be considered? You are supposed to be a hero. The dragoncalled would never commit suicide with the belief that some ancient magic would bring them back.

What that basically tells us is that you do not value life since you have no fear of dying. I cannot make the decision to do this, but if this becomes a common practice among players, I would fully support increasing death penalties and or lowering the soul strand count before permadeath.

Death is something that should be respected. The bindstones are not there to save your butt if you get into a situation that is over your head.

Acacea · « **Reply #11 on:** August 21, 2006, 07:55:40 pm »

This is a grey area because it is indeed an IC system, but one that is necessary because of OOC circumstances that a lot of people would be happy without. Any DM I know would be pretty ticked at a player taking the bindstone express out of circumstances they've constructed, and would likely either port the character back or just refuse them re-entry into the quest.

If the bindstones, an in character system, were repeatedly used on purpose to get out of a sticky situation, I'd personally just get rid of them for a few days. Or a few hours. Oops... guess no one should have relied on those, they seem to be on the fritz!

Again, rejoice that it is not so.

As an edited note, one can't really say "no one of the Dragoncalled would do x" because we have such a wide variety of people called, or as it is right now, anybodies just wandering into Hlint following rumors of fame. They might very well do that yes, as I can't speak for every character on the server, but the player needs to find another response to it so that something essentially saving us from all having permed characters isn't more abused than it already is.

Filatus · « **Reply #12 on:** August 21, 2006, 08:07:03 pm »

Personally, I always viewed the bindstones as part RP and part OOC practicality. The force respawn on a third death for example I deem as completely RP-able. Now, when considering choosing to respawn yourself you have to take into consideration the following.

This being that if you know you are going to be raised you wait, but when you know that is not going to happen you choose to respawn. So, the one moment you are lying dead, perhaps for an ingame day or more. I've known situations on quests where the lifeless bodies of partymembers were dragged along for quite a long time in hope of raising them later. All this time they do not respawn.

This makes respawning within seconds a bit strange. Because clearly, the character could never have any influence on whether or not he respawns, he's dead after all. In the period that a character is dead, time passes without him ever being aware. I would think that a player choosen respawn would still have to be some kind of trigger in the bindstone magic.

After all, the soul of the dead would be judged by the Soulmother if he has not returned to a bindstone before a certain time, after three days (3 ingame days, listed under server rules, correct me if I'm wrong).

So clearly the bindstone magic would have to kick in before this period. This period would be long enough to be given plenty of time for raising, but certainly not longer than perhaps a day or two.

On the respawning to get out of a situation. If you are killed on a quest, choosing to respawn is in no way an acceptable means to get out of a nasty situation. Just as with your fellow partymembers, even your enemies would have the time to raise you before the bindstones call you.

Of course, there will always be the ooc practical function of the bindstones to keep it fun.

But as I see it, it will definately be a few more hours, perhaps a day or two, before the bindstones respawn your body. When you respawn you have no clue how much time has passed since your death anyway, until someone informs you.

So, respawning out of practicality is quite fine and the time lapse is easily RP-able, if you don't run into any people you were with before you died within minutes.

Respawning to prevent your enemies from perhaps raising receives a big stamp of disapproval from me.

PS: On the kidnapping, of course it is possible, but with player consent and GM surveillance in my opinion. Not that I'd recomment it to anyone. It is an approach which will likely provide more disadvantages than advantages.

silverdraco · « **Reply #13 on:** August 22, 2006, 03:53:27 am »

Filatus.
Your idea's on when to respawn. sounds interesting to me. Perhapes I'll try it myself, espacialy when on quests or with other players.

Ar7 · « **Reply #14 on:** August 22, 2006, 07:26:27 am »

I would like to say two things and keep it short....hopefully

First of all, I really do not like that the Bindstone is viewed as a guaranteed escape. Sometimes it seems that IC people see death as a sort of common cold, because everybody knows that they will return.

Secondly, I would like to say that kidnapping has been done before, it was after an IC insult for which the character in question payed dearly. I shall not reveal anything more and if the player who was the kidnapper will want to write more, he shall do so.

I managed to keep it short, thank you for reading.

Diablo_68 · « **Reply #15 on:** August 22, 2006, 07:45:25 am »

I would think that IC you have seen people die and not come back, so your character although he might have died and returned they know it is not certain because well you are dieing......

Dieing is pretty painful (i assume) so in this example of a kidnap i think most characters would wait and see what the motives are and the chances of escape or being saved before you jump on your own sword or cast a fireball at your feet. Also if you are kidnapped and tied up you wont be able to cast (without still+silent spell) or attack so how are you goignt o kill yourself? Someone runs up smacks you over the head and starts to tie you up, you struggle free and slice your neck?

Lastly i think a kidnap is a great idea but like everyone else said needs to be RP well and if possable a GM present, really as long as you have people willing to RP and the situation is not stupid you can RP anything.

Wraithdur · « **Reply #16 on:** August 22, 2006, 07:56:27 am »

(wow this is off track)
None of my characters are Dragon called, and i have no idea about Bindsones, their purpose, who built them, what the terms of their use are.
but i don't think this is the right thread to talk about them, and/or their place on Layonara.

So basically a kidnapping would have to be predetermined hours in advance, and executed in situations that would have to be pre-planned (who knows if your going to meet a band of pirates who abduct you) and the purpose/outcome would have to be discussed at length. by which time you have been standing still for 20minutes without an IC comment to be heard, the powers that be think you are camping and send a large spawn that you could never defeat, you get killed and the Bindstone (in it's infinite untold wisdom) has taken away a soul strand.

the verdict : PC's shouldn't pioneer new RP situations

P.S. i have a phoebia of Bindstones since one of my characters lost a soul strand at lvl 4

Acacea · « **Reply #17 on:** August 22, 2006, 08:04:13 am »

That's kind of a lame way of translating what was basically, "Don't decide what happens to a character that isn't yours. Make sure it's cool with them and that the situation is roleplayed with appropriate skill rolls."

Stephen_Zuckerman · « **Reply #18 on:** August 22, 2006, 05:32:39 pm »

Thank you all for the input on the Bindstones; it was a reasonably new idea for me, but on a bit further thought, it's not really an appropriate course of action to kill oneself (or blatantly let oneself be killed) unless one would do the same in a Binstone-less existance.

Kidnapping, GMs, and You!
I would consider this essentially a more-interesting form of PvP. Have a DM or not, you're still going to be doing pretty much the same rolls. It's just who coordinates everything that changes. (And possibly some slightly cooler effects, or NPCs, but aside from that...)

FlameStrike · « **Reply #19 on:** August 23, 2006, 10:10:36 am »

Quote

Filatus - 8/22/2006 4:07 AM

Respawning to prevent your enemies from perhaps raising receives a big stamp of disapproval from me.

I had read somewhere that you are only brought back if your soul wills it so, at least in PnP. Of course that, in NwN a cleric can just walk up to your corpse and just cast the spell, bringing you back, as this was a form of abuse when it came to PvP, killing your enemy, raising him, killing again, and so on. It's a matter of game mechanics.

So anyway, the point here is: it's bad RP to respawn, fearing an enemy might cast Raise Dead or Ressurect, or even Animate Dead if a GM is around, since things can be worked out on the scene. Other than that, if no friendly cleric is around, then a respawn is in order. It's just a cheap easy way out of something that would be a serious problem for you.

There aren't always GM's around wherever people go, and since this isn't a campaign of sorts in which if you died, you'd stay dead unless ressurected by a cleric or some other means, the Bindstones provide that service for you at a cost, although it doesn't mean it should be over-used. We know this is a game and it wouldn't be fun if you'd just stay dead, hehe.

My 2 cents on this, everything that has to be said about Bindstones has already been brought up.