Breakable, armor, clothes, equipement, shields and weapons

[jrizz]

I so dont like the idea of uber expensive items breaking (unless you do something dumb like wack a vein too many times). But if this was put into effect then the prices for armor and swords would be affected the same way say arrows and bolts are. They a perishable items and thus prices would have to drop to reflect that. One of the reasons for the high price of swords, armor, shields is that they dont go away once they are made, so if there was a time limit or whatever method for the life span of these items then the prices should drop to reflect that. Lots of gold would still move around, the idea of breakable items would by no means remove more gold from the system as a matter of fact it would put more gold into the system. Now the idea of getting repairs through a NPC crafter (that would put the item back to 100%) that would take a lot of gold out of the system. The higher the quality of item the higher the coast to fix it. This would drain gold more from the top then the bottom.

Costs could be based on the lens value and metal/wood/skin of the item:
Copper, Hickory 10% of item value to fix
Bronze 20% of the item value to fix
Iron, Oak 30% of the item value to fix
Platty 40% of the item value to fix
Addy, Mahogany 50% of the item value to fix
Mithril, Yew 75% of the item value to fix
Dropped rare items would cause a bit of a issue but they can be mapped to some type.

[Dorganath]

It's important to note...breakage will not just happen. What will happen first is the weapon/item itself will get "fatigued" or whatever term we assign and that will make it less effective or something like that. Only after an extended period of use with a fatigued weapon or whatever will it actually break.
  In other words, weapons shouldn't be randomly breaking in combat, for example. Also, higher-end items would be more durable than low-end items.

[Guardian 452]

At this time are you going with the items eventually breaking... poof gone?

or damaged to the point that they cant be equipped untill repaired? And if it goes that far it cost a lot more to fix than normal repairs.

Id hate to be on Underdark map 78 and have my good and maybe only blade go poof cause it's taken so much damage since we set out. So the idea of it becoming un equipable is more appealing.

[Dorganath]

*points up*
  Items won't suddenly break. They'll degrade. Whatever mechanism that takes place once an item is degraded or unusable hasn't really been decided. I kind of doubt items will be "poof, gone" as you say either. Rather they'll be useless or really quite uneffective...or possibly unequipable.

[Guardian 452]

I know they wont go from pristine to broken and gone I saw that.... but some of thoese underdark trips can last 6 hours + and with a TON of fights.... my concern was leaving Arabel with a pristine weapon, shield, etc etc... and 5 hours later on the 78th Underdark map your item has degraded to the point of breaking and is lost forever..... so I thought the un equipable method would sit better with people.... We already have people afraid to adventure because of tokens... Let's not add a fear of loosing gear it took RL years to earn to that I say!

EDIT - But it say its damaged to the point that you can no longer equip it... at least you have it still and if you can afford it pay top have it refurbished to it's pristine condition.... this service (bringing an item back from unusable) should be more expensive than basic repairs too.

[Dorganath]

Guardian 452 - 10/30/2006  2:56 PM  I know they wont go from pristine to broken and gone I saw that.... but some of thoese underdark trips can last 6 hours + and with a TON of fights.... my concern was leaving Arabel with a pristine weapon, shield, etc etc... and 5 hours later on the 78th Underdark map your item has degraded to the point of breaking and is lost forever..... so I thought the un equipable method would sit better with people.... We already have people afraid to adventure because of tokens... Let's not add a fear of loosing gear it took RL years to earn to that I say!

 That is exactly what I am saying will not happen. People won't live in fear of their hard-earned weapons and armor evaporating in a cloud of metal dust or wood chips from one single long outing. The last time we talked about this, the intent was not to make people fear losing their weapons, especially the very valuable ones, but rather to present some gradual degradation that can be managed through repairs.
  I think it is very unlikely that a broken weapon will be lost forever. If indeed it breaks due to neglecting it, there will probably be a repair process, though probably an expensive one.

[jrizz]

so the perishable aspect is addressed. But what about G-452's thought? Some trips are long and filled with lots-o-fights. If the possability for a item to degrade during a single trip exists then PCs will carry multi high end weapons, armors, and shields. This will only add to server lag. I can see players figuring out exactly how many hits a item can take before it losses any pluses and packing spares of everything to make sure they are always at the best they can be.

[Stephen_Zuckerman]

Idea: Whetstones.

On a long, long trip to the Underdark, which lasts sixish hours realtime, your characters are spending a MINIMUM of four days underground. Assuming you actually camp at any point in there... Well, you do the math. If you're fighting hard, constantly, for four days solid, you're going to have some wear and tear. Major wear and tear.

What does a warrior do with his blade as soon as camp is pitched? He pulls out a whetstone and sharpens it, helping with at least some of the dulling and chipping of the edge.

So, have a flint-and-steel like item that would restore a small number of lost durability points. Or perhaps give it charges, and have it restore points equal to the charges you expend (with a modifier for weapon material).

[jrizz]

Nice Idea!

[Dorganath]

Can we please stop predicting doom before this is even fully designed?
  Where did the idea come from that a weapon, armor, shield or whatever could go from pristine to scrap in one trip?
  The interval of degradation and the mechanics behind it are something which need to be worked out, but I'm fairly certain that if weapons were made to be that fragile, the system would quickly sap the fun out of adventuring, which is something we don't want to do.
  Whetstones are a little narrow of a concept, as they don't address non-edged weapons, armor (one does not sharpen leather, for example) or other non-weapon items.. I believe above I have mentioned two methods of item repair: NPCs and repair kits. The latter can be taken along for field repairs...and they're not as good as having an NPC do it, but it can stave off the effects of degradation over long trips.
  Again, this has not been fully designed or balanced, so please, let's not predict it's failure just yet and have some confidence that we'll work out the correct balance for Layonara.

[Guardian 452]

Wasn't trying to kill the idea in any way shape or form. Its the closest thing we will have to realism.... if the items just go unuseable that doesnt get them out of circulation and make more business for crafters... but it's certainly a start.

The combination of NPC and "field kits" (several kinds for different types of repairs) are awesome ideas... even better if the "field kits" are only craftable thru CNR!!!  Then every craftsman who sells their goods can also push these "field kits" and keep money flowing in!


EDIT Example Field Kits.... Whetstones for blades, patches of cloth and leather with a needle & string for leather and clothing items ... etc...

[Dorganath]

Guardian 452 - 10/30/2006  4:31 PM  The combination of NPC and "field kits" (several kinds for different types of repairs) are awesome ideas... even better if the "field kits" are only craftable thru CNR!!!  Then every craftsman who sells their goods can also push these "field kits" and keep money flowing in!  

 Um...probably the kits would not be craftable, because we want that gold out of the system, not shifted around the system.

[Guardian 452]

*shrug* either way.... I was just thinking of ways to help all of us whiney crafters  

[jrizz]

No predictions of doom just helping to flesh out the idea. I for one think it can be a great added item both for cutting down on gold in the system (although is there really too much gold in the system? most of the people I talk to in game are on the poor side) and having some fun RP around it. I often RP that I am working on my armor or weapons.

[Hellblazer]

I'd like to know if anything has been developed for this?

[Dorganath]

For NWN? No. For the MMO? Yes.

[Hellblazer]

thanks