Author Topic: Crafting Recertification (Read 897 times)

D Blaze · « **on:** January 01, 2006, 07:07:00 am »

With the installation of a required badge to craft, you may have hit the jackpot on how to force money out of the system, but in a good way

Every so often, according to Crafting Association standards, or whatever, a crafter must get a new badge to prove they are still able to craft properly.

It's like the liscense plate tag you have to get periodically. It's a pain, but a neccessity.

After so much time, the badges will get changed and no longer work (maybe something like changing keys on a house).
The only way to get it working again is to go to the vendor and get re-certified(losing your old to get the new).
Having gotten in once, the updating wouldn't cost as much as the initial badge itself...but then, maybe it should.

The lesser badge (due to the more commonness of the items involved) would not need to be rechecked as often as the advanced badge.
And since the advanced badge would have to be redone more often, and cost alot more, all dedicated crafters are forced to pay the governments for the priveledge like a Tax.

Yes!! even a fake government found a new way to work over it's citizens

Red Monkey · « **Reply #1 on:** January 01, 2006, 06:02:00 pm »

Just found out the hard way a tailor table doesnt work without a badge....
Crafting for me is off again on again....don't have a lot of time to gather stuff and wheel-deal it yet.

Finding out I need to shell out 750 gold to stay a level 3 tailor that cannot sell his product yet...
Well as a level 5 character who may have seen 800 gold total so far..no thanks.

No crafting for me, for any character.
First real sour note.

Leanthar · « **Reply #2 on:** January 01, 2006, 06:06:00 pm »

"Well as a level 5 character who may have seen 800 gold total so far..no thanks."
I hear you there... however... don't think of it as 'so far' think of it as you are investing for the future. You will be able to make a profit, have no doubt.
To each their own though. But I do hear what you are saying. 750gp is pretty cheap though.

LoganGrimnar · « **Reply #3 on:** January 01, 2006, 06:35:00 pm »

22k isent... *shrugs* but it will make things more interesting. I wouldent hope to see it removed, but i wont be crafting for sometime now. and i might add, not everyone crafts for themselves. I have yet to craft anything for coin, i do infusing becouse its intertaining, 75% of my other crafts are done so i can become better and what is intertaining me. My hope is to make a decent staff for myself, and to do so i must become skilled in many many crafts. *shrugs* just makes my life harder.

SquareKnot · « **Reply #4 on:** January 01, 2006, 06:52:00 pm »

From the comments above, it sounds like the changes to the craft system are having the intended effect. To make crafting a serious character decision, rather than something that everyone just does. Yet at the same time, no one is limited, like saying that only dwarves can use a forge, or each character can only do 3 crafts. I know that the martial/monk requirements on the wood ax still bother me. At least a feat can overcome that. Anyway, anyone who really wants to craft will pry loose 750 gp somehow.

I did want to clarify whether or not the badges last (essentially) forever, or if they expire at some determined time, as D_Blaze mentioned in the original post in this thread.

Red Monkey · « **Reply #5 on:** January 01, 2006, 07:13:00 pm »

Oh I see the whole picture and it's understandable and all. Small price to pay and all that.

But it's a hurdle I did not see coming and it just aggravates me to no end....doing something constructive as a character has been hard as of late and it's hard to see the long term right now.

Just been a crabby week.

Dorganath · « **Reply #6 on:** January 01, 2006, 07:30:00 pm »

Quote

SquareKnot - 1/1/2006 8:52 PM
I did want to clarify whether or not the badges last (essentially) forever, or if they expire at some determined time, as D_Blaze mentioned in the original post in this thread.

Crafting badges do not expire. If there are plans to make them expire, I have not heard them. I highly doubt it, however, because they were always intended to be one-time purchases.

Leanthar · « **Reply #7 on:** January 01, 2006, 08:55:00 pm »

Dorg is correct. They are a one time purchase. At this time I don't see why we need to change that--but no promises for down the future because, well I can't see the future. heh
But I do not think they will be changing from a one time purchase.

Ar7 · « **Reply #8 on:** January 02, 2006, 03:13:00 am »

Those badges remind me of the days long passed, I think I still have the greater gem setting tool that cost 50 000 gold pieces, somewhere in a bank chest, never dared to throw so much money away

cappyra · « **Reply #9 on:** January 03, 2006, 11:16:00 am »

In the past I have had characters gather all required components to craft an item, and then ask if I can make it.

I don't do this often... but I have done it. Then I generally charge at least half the item's value... if not more.

Why? Because it took a lot of work, time and money to attain a high level of crafting. The badge is a good example to the prospective customer when justifying a price.

I like the idea of badges.

Leanthar · « **Reply #10 on:** January 03, 2006, 11:30:00 am »

"The badge is a good example to the prospective customer when justifying a price."
Yep, exactly. We can also add a gold cost to items but have not gone down that road (though we did do it in testing). This would also be a great justification to charge a certain price.

Doc-Holiday · « **Reply #11 on:** January 03, 2006, 09:24:00 pm »

This will also create a large group of people who would rather buy then make. Weston can no longer afford to make potions and such so .. he is now a buyer.

Victor · « **Reply #12 on:** January 04, 2006, 06:27:00 am »

For a follower of Dorand, crafting is not just a way to profit, it's a religion. When a worshipper of Dorand crafts, it is a form of prayer. In essence, the guilds and governments responsible for the crafting "certification" just put a tax on every follower's ability to practice his or her faith.

Harlas Ravelkione · « **Reply #13 on:** January 04, 2006, 06:37:00 am »

@ Victor: The certificate makes good sense. It ensures that the crafthouses, facilities and equipment are well maintained, as well as cleaning of the houses and equipment. It is a one-time expense, and everyone will have to pay it.
In the end the motives of most people are to craft for themselves, or to sell to others. The first category saves money because they save from not having to buy their equipment from others. The second category gains money from sales (and they can craft for themselves as well).
It differs little if one is a follower of Dorand. Why should they have special rights when they basically carry out the same work? They should not.

jrizz · « **Reply #14 on:** January 04, 2006, 03:58:00 pm »

I dont disagree with the certification addition. But for those of us who are less (way way less) wealthy, this hurts. I worked my way up to be able to craft some items in the advanced house (not an easy thing to do) and now I have to spend every GP I have (and then some) to go back in and craft. I hate to say it (cause I know it will bring the wrath down on me) but this favors the rich. So I tried to go on a goblin and gnoll killing spree to raise the funds (got killed by spiders LOL).

Stranzini · « **Reply #15 on:** January 15, 2006, 03:14:00 pm »

I'm surprised nobody said it...

The only thing that does not make sense is why you can practice every single craft with only one badge.

In real-world terms, that wouldn't really make sense - the badge seems to represent membership in some guild, and jewelers and carpenters really aren't going to be in the same guild - in fact they will want to jealously guard access to their market from each other as much or more than from all the rest of the hoi polloi. Guild jewelers are not going to want the carpenters making jewelry.

As far as the objective of balancing the economy - a one time hit of a few hundred isn't really going to change much of anything. As a once-in-a-lifetime buy, I kind of think everybody will end up getting a badge sooner or later. Maybe some people will never craft, but they wouldn't have been big crafters anyway. Some people may just start a little later. But once the badge is paid for there is no discouraging effect to craft all you want - I'm not convinced it will change anybody's behavior.

But if I had to buy a badge for every different craft I wanted to practice...that would be something that would make me think twice about whether I was going to do all the crafts, and maybe it would make me deal with other crafters for the parts I need that come from their crafts. I might still choose to do all the crafts in the end - but I would think about it a lot more carefully, and maybe decide to stick to fewer.

The easiest thing to do would be to require a different badge for each type of workstation. And the prices don't have to be all the same either - cooking might be cheap, jewelry making expensive.

There could even be a different badge for each craft center - why would I be allowed to use the Port Hampshire center if I paid to belong to the guild in Hlint? Unless I was willing to also pay a fee to join the Port Hampshire guild...

I know this is more complicated, but I just don't think you're going to see any real change in player choices from just the one-time fee, once we get over our initial griping at having to come up with some gold right now - and I think we're all pretty much over that already!

Filatus · « **Reply #16 on:** February 23, 2006, 06:54:12 pm »

Ehm.. I'm feeling in a creative mood tonight. I'd like to bump this post so developers might see Stranzini's post just above mine. I think he has a really good idea here to make it more costly to practice several crafts.

Nyralotep · « **Reply #17 on:** February 23, 2006, 07:16:15 pm »

Having multiple crafting badges for each hall...I imagine the scripting for that would be complex.

Making crafting more costly to practice however only really effects the low level players who don't have the gold laying around while ensuring lesscompetition for the characters who have made thier levels in crafting. Established characters already have gold in the bank and won't be hurt by making it more expensive.

The best method is the one that won't work becuase is requeires players to exercise restraint. When Amaduena crafts, little of what she crafts is sold to other players. Most of it is dontated to the temple of Mist or sold to the pawn. I'm not in it to make money but because of the satisfaction I get from crafting.

Filatus · « **Reply #18 on:** February 23, 2006, 07:17:45 pm »

Good point, the only thing that remains in that respect is having a maximum of crafts to be advanced in.

Stranzini · « **Reply #19 on:** February 23, 2006, 11:50:32 pm »

I'm not an expert but I would have guessed that the crafting script is attached to the table not the hall - is it really that much harder to check the player's inventory for the presence of "name_of_table_crafting_badge" rather than "level_crafting_badge"?