Knock down and improve knock down.

[Hellblazer]

First a question. Is the duration of a successful knockdown based in seconds or is it turned based?

I'm asking because when you succeed a knockdown and you have over 4 foes fighting you beside the one that is down, You really don't get much time to utilize the effect you just inflected. WHile you wait to be able to actually hit at your turn, while by that time the foe you just put down is getting back up.

So I would suggest upping the duration of the effect of knockdown due to that fact.

[lonnarin]

It really looks like it's up to two turns.  The first one when you knock them down, and then a full turn of wailing on them until they stand up again.  This is not a scientific answer of course, just what I feel that it feels like.  As for upping the duration, I think that is unnecessary.  You can spam knockdown like no tomorrow, and with enough successes you can keep an enemy down almost indefinitely with a full barrage of attacks.  If you manage to hit a knockdown right at the moment they're standing up, they go right back down without getting more than a single attack off.  in fact, I ease up on the knockdown-spam for wee bit that they're down, since the attack roll is 4 higher without it being used.  A team with multiple knockdown users is rather overwhealming.  I'd actually suggest that more enemies had the feat as a nice little suprise for us, rather than improving our own knockdowns.

[HooD!uM]

well i know that some of the ogres have knockdown in the hammerbounds, i only noticed that yesterday when we went there, and yes i was suprised. But i would like to see some sort of custom feats for warriors, how about shield bash or headbutts, or even a elbow to the nose that stuns cause honestly warriors are in need of some good assault feats in combat, all they have is cleave, power attack (which i reckon is underused, as i never see anyone using it other than chopping woor or mining) and knockdown (might be a couple more i cant remember.

ps// if you up the lenght of knockdown just remember this, your enemies will have theirs upped too, then someone will soon say " can we lower the time of knockdown" X creatures are killing me too fast before i get back up.

[Hellblazer]

Normally I would agree with you. But just today again. I had put down a troll while his friends were trying to hit me. I couldn't even get one shot in before it got up, since I kept avoiding getting hit. And it's a constant thing that I have noticed. When you fight one on one, it works great. One on many, it becomes very much less effective because of that problem.

[Hellblazer]

well i know that some of the ogres have knockdown in the hammerbounds, i only noticed that yesterday when we went there, and yes i was suprised. But i would like to see some sort of custom feats for warriors, how about shield bash or headbutts, or even a elbow to the nose that stuns cause honestly warriors are in need of some good assault feats in combat, all they have is cleave, power attack (which i reckon is underused, as i never see anyone using it other than chopping woor or mining) and knockdown (might be a couple more i cant remember.

ps// if you up the lenght of knockdown just remember this, your enemies will have theirs upped too, then someone will soon say " can we lower the time of knockdown" X creatures are killing me too fast before i get back up.

Reason why power attack is under used is it takes already some AB out of the much needed ab to beat the stronger foes.

And yes I agree it would up the time of your enemies. But I don't know many foes that uses it. And it givs an importance to the skill points discipline for fighters :p

[Acacea]

As with most things, it is harder alone than with a team (even a pair) of buddies ready to jump it. In a group, the thing to get knocked down is the dead thing. A single rogue in your party means sneak attacks for the entire duration of the effect, which is a very tasty bonus especially if said rogue is hasted... it's deadly when used right, heh, and is spammed like there is no tomorrow.

[Dorganath]

ps// if you up the lenght of knockdown just remember this, your enemies will have theirs upped too, then someone will soon say " can we lower the time of knockdown" X creatures are killing me too fast before i get back up.

This is a very important point, and people need to recognize if we up Knockdown for you, we will also up Knockdown against you.

Speaking more generally, in the right conditions, Knockdown is can be really devastating.  It's less impressive when soloing against many, but when there's a group vs. a group and one of more in one group is knocking down the other, then it can significantly tip the balance of combat.

[Aerimor]

Knockdown in my opinion is well balanced as it is now.  It is made with a fighter in mind.  Consider the following.

You can knockdown an opponent once a round.  That opponent will stay down until the same segment of the round next cycles up.  If you knock them down with your first attack, they stand up right before your first attack. Thus you can knock them down with your first attack again.

When you knock somethign down or hit them and fail to knock them down, they still take normal damage.  You do not give up an attack for it and if you are successful it keeps one opponent from effectively being able to cast or melee.

So if your a standard fighter with 4 attacks a round.  You lead off each round with a knockdown, do your damage for your first attack and make your next three attacks at normal chances to hit.  They stand up and you knock them down again.  This is very powerful and effective, if you can afford the -4 to hit and have multiple attacks in a round.  Or in other words as you start gaining levels.

This coupled with enough foes that have knockdown immunity, high discipline and high armor classes I think keeps the knockdown feat very useful and not overpowered.  I'd prefer not to see it changed.

[Asmodean]

So if your a standard fighter with 4 attacks a round.  You lead off each round with a knockdown, do your damage for your first attack and make your next three attacks at normal chances to hit.

I believe your enemy loses any dexterity and dodge bonuses while prone, so your subsequent attacks have a higher chance of landing and causing damage.

[s0ulz]

I believe your enemy loses any dexterity and dodge bonuses while prone, so your subsequent attacks have a higher chance of landing and causing damage.

In addition to this, those attacking a LORE: Prone character gain +4 to their to-hit attack bonus in melee, however ranged attackers suffer -4 to their to-hit.